[00:00:00] Tayson: Everybody welcome back to the Live Ultralight Podcast, powered by Outdoor Vitals. Today we have special guest Hunter Leininger on the show and share his view on Life. Share his view on some amazing. Well I'm getting some like a million Amazing Adventures that he started at a very young age. I'm gonna read a quick bio and then I'm gonna give you some sneak peeks into what this podcast was. Like it was it was exceptional so Hunter's an endurance-sports athlete. He's an ultra Runner Mountaineer, mountain biker content creator and reality TV star. The eager son of an endurance athlete Hunter set. His first world record by becoming the youngest finisher of a 24-hour National Championship at age 11, and has since set records and FKTs in Expedition racing adventure racing mountain biking, endurance races and ultrarunning and recently joined a project covering the highest peaks of each state over 42 days and just became the fastest to ever run across Florida in 63 hours, 52 minutes, a record that was once held by David Goggins, which I find a little funny because in this conversation, you'll find out that David Goggins and Hunter probably share some some commonalities. Especially when it comes to their mental fortitude. Hunter has an incredible incredible rap sheet of just All of the races that he's been doing starting at age seven, his first Adventure, Race was at age seven and going on, he's only 22 and he's accomplished so much. But what I think you'll find in this podcast is, it's not really about the accomplishments that he's done. It's about what else you can learn from Hunter. His view on life and his approach to things is, is a breath of fresh air. I guess you could say, and it's really inspiring and I think that you'll all be able to learn some things from this interview. So, Without further Ado, I'm going to go ahead and roll this podcast. I know you guys will really enjoy it and I know you'll be able to take some amazing things out of it Hunter, I'm excited to have you on the podcast. And I'm actually I would say overwhelmed of where to even begin this conversation because I got this the sheet here which if you're watching on YouTube be able to see this. This is like size one font and It just all of the things that you've done so far in your. I don't know if you're still 20, but 20 up to 20 years of life on the sheet and it's and it's just, it's, it's overwhelming, but it's all just so cool. And so wild. So, I want to dive into. I guess a good starting point is just the beginning, right? So you started to do some of these Adventure races At seven years old. I'm going to guess that at that point you were pretty, you're pretty influenced by watching some people around you doing these right. I think it was your dad, if I'm from Correct and just kind of your background, but as far as you remember, like what what was it like to get started in these? What was your drive? What were you really hoping to do? when you're seven years old and entering in an Adventure Race,
[Editor’s note: The opening biography, age, record, FKT, Florida, David Goggins, media, profession, and 50-state statements are preserved as March 2024 source claims. The introduction’s broad highest-peaks wording is later narrowed by Hunter, who says he was the project filmmaker and summited about 45 peaks; none of these claims is independently current-verified here.]
[00:03:02] Hunter: Yeah, so great to talk to you and big fan of the company and everything. But yeah, that the list is funny that only ended that 20 years old. I have an updated to the past two years of like got them out of things. We've jammed in the past two years, just insane, but super grateful. Again, I started events when I was seven years old so it's been 15 years of doing all these Adventures. So when I was seven years old, Basically my dad used to do these Adventures, which is adventure racing: running, biking, and canoeing races that are all off-road. There's no marked course. You basically get a map and a compass at the start of the race, and you've got to make up your own course. And at the time when I was six years old, I asked him. Hey, Dad. Can I do one of these races with you? And he was like, absolutely no, like no. Kids are allowed to do these races. Like it's Heard it for kids to do in for endurance races. It's too dangerous. You'll get dirty, you'll get injured all this stuff so after a year begging him he eventually is like all right I'll let you do a race with me. Just to shut you up and I eventually got into the race and we had to go through all these loopholes like convincing the race director that this was safe. My dad was gonna take care of me, sign, insurance policies, all this. Complicated stuff. But finally got to the start line at seven years old. And from that moment on it was like I did that race in my dad and it was mainly. I just wanted to spend time with my dad and it was like adventuring gave that to me whereas like I used to play football on, my dad was always in the sidelines cheering me on but eventually gave me the opportunity for him to be in the game with me and we were playing together. So from that six hour race, I've basically just fell in love with the sport. Fell into mud up to my waist, lost my shoes found a bone. Saw some wild pigs. Like so many cool experiences that seven years old that I was like I was hooked for life. From that moment on I was like every single year I would just do a longer and longer adventures and now 15 years later on. I'm still that little kid that's stuck in the mud up to my neck now,
[00:04:50] Tayson: No, that's that's awesome that you've been able to I guess bond with your dad over that and and share those experiences, I think everyone, you know looks for opportunities. It's cool that you were able to find that. You know, it's seven years old and to just be all in on something like that. There's it's I'm curious. I mean, my mind went to Like did you start like training for these or how to I mean I guess I I don't know. So in the endurance and ultra-endurance world right, there is a whole gamut of things that you can do for training nutrition, hydration, you know, all of these things. But at this age like are you aware of any of that or like, what are you doing? I guess.
[00:05:32] Hunter: No, it was honestly for the perfect first like five to ten years. It was just get out in the woods and have fun and it wasn't like I was doing these races. I'm like I'm trying to beat everybody here. Like I was the only kid. The average age was 40 50 year olds in here. And I'm seven years old running along with my dad. It was never about like, oh let's try to push herself and win this race. It was like, let's just go have fun in. The cool thing about adventure racing is the course is true up to you. You don't have to go get all the checkpoints. You can kind of design your own course. You get your map and compass and you're like oh that's section is too far. I'm going to skip that one. I'm gonna go do these. I'm really good at biking so I'm gonna bike a lot. I'm gonna skip the paddles. You can choose your own adventure so it was no pressure of like you have to perform at the top level for the first Year's. There's just again just go out with my dad and all right motivation at the beginning was like no kids were doing this that the second-youngest racers were in their late 20s. So it's like for me to be seven. It was all about like okay, we're inspiring some people like man people are seeing this little kid doing these races alongside and that's really cool. So it's like we got this mission of like, trying to inspire more people. So, it was always about doing the next longest race ever. So went from a six hour race to a 10 hour to a 24-hour national championships to a five-day race to the world championships. All these different things. Try to break these records for the youngest person ever do these races and we set multiple world records in the process, but it wasn't like We were trying to kill ourselves and push really hard. It was really just what came fun to us and as soon as they stopped being fun, we're like, okay, let's try something else. So
[00:07:02] Tayson: yeah. So is that why? Like going back to just the the concept of an Adventure Race. So if it's a six hour race you just continue to do everything for six hours, the end, the end is the end. Like there's not like you have to, like you say, hit every checkpoint and do every possible thing that they've got their you're just saying all right. How many things can I check off a list essentially in the six hours?
[00:07:20] Hunter: Yeah. So basically you get the map at the beginning in there is for six hour race. Let's just guess this this 20 checkpoints and checkpoints are these orienteering flags at the hang up in the woods, and they're hidden on the map. So it's not like, on a road. It's like you running along the road. And you have to go 100 meters into the woods, and into the swamp and find this checkpoint. So this 20 of those hidden Easter eggs, around this map, and you basically, choose whatever Easter eggs, you want to go get. And at the end of the six hours, whatever, team gets the most Easter eggs, wins the race. So we were coming there and getting like 10 Easter eggs and like finishing back of the pack middle of The pack, it didn't really matter. Well, the teams are going all out for six hours and getting them all. So that's kind of how adventurous Racing's explained.
[00:08:00] Tayson: Yeah, that's a I don't feel like there's much of it or I haven't I guess been exposed to the world of adventure racing but that sounds like a pretty good time and it sounds like it's a pretty fun time as a group too so that's super interesting. See so you can continue to do these these races. You're getting older and older. You start to really I mean like at 12 years old and I think I'm seeing like eight different types of races that you did or or events. I guess that you did that year and it just kind of goes up from there. So talk to me about like the progression for you, right? Like what was the progression for you? What was the why for you to move on from adventure racing or try new things?
[00:08:41] Hunter: Yeah, so for I guess like 13 years, I only did adventure racing. So basically up until I was like, yeah, I would say 19, I just did of interesting, I didn't mountain bike racing endurance races and stuff but it was mostly adventuring. That was what I loved and that was where I thought like I could make the biggest impact and I had the most fun in that. But the impact part I was like again I was told ever since I was seven years old, that kids are not supposed to do this. This is impossible for seven year old or a 12 year old to Race Across the entire state Florida. So it was always like trying to prove to myself and at the time I was proving other people that like this was possible to a kid to do these crazy things and you just because you have a dream doesn't mean you push it off ten years down the road if you want to run 100 miles, find out how to do it now and just go do it. Don't wait until you're 40 years old? Just do it. So that was kind of my driving force of keep doing these long adventures and again, it was Big motivation was just being with my dad, it was one of the only sports that I could raise my dad and have fun and like adventuring is a team sport so you could be a two-person team a three-person team or four-person team so you can race with your family can race with friends. You could all come together and that was really unique for me to just spend that time with my dad in bond. We did so many different adventures and traveled through most of the states and across the world and all these really cool experiences was because I want to spend time with my dad and then, when I Did the Eco challenge, which I don't know if you're familiar with Eco challenge.
[00:10:06] Tayson: just a little bit, but let's let's have you kind of give an overview of people that aren't
[00:10:10] Hunter: So the Eco challenge is the toughest race Adventure is out there, so it's a 12-day Race Across Fiji and it's stopped in 2002. And then in 2019, Bear Grylls, the adventure guy. That everybody knows, he brought it back as a TV show. So he was casting people and we got casted because I was the youngest Adventure racer ever. So we got to go to Fiji and race for 12 days across. Fiji and it was again filmed on a TV show. So that was basically the Pinnacle of everybody and adventure racing. There was like the Pinnacle for sport as always about getting to the stage where you can do Eco Challenge and a 18 years old, I finished the race and set the record for the youngest to ever do the Eco Challenge. And I kind of after that I kind of felt empty. I was like, man my entire life has been doing these longer and longer Adventure races from expedition-length world championships to Eco Challenge. And now that it's finished Eco challenge. What else is there there isn't anything tougher than Eco challenge in that realm so that's when I started branching off into like ultra running. I basically on a whim. I was like, hey running a hundred miles, sounds fun. I don't want to wait a few years to do it. Let me just go do it like, next month. So, with no training, I went and did a hundred mile. It was the worst experience I was in so much pain, my legs hurt. So bad that I was like, oh man, this is like great.
[00:11:26] Tayson: Yeah, we've got to slow down and talk about this, right? I've done a couple of Ultras and this year, I went out on a limb and literally signed up for my first 100, Miler I signed up for it last week and I've got, I've only got three months to train for this thing, which, you know, for most people's like, oh, it's three months. But for most people that actually Run, 100, like that's nothing, right? That's like, like they're training way farther out, right? I just wasn't really planning. I guess I'm doing 100. And when I was playing on doing it, I was thinking it'd be in the second half of the year and so I got looking at races, I just wasn't able to find what I was looking for an opportunity and the later half the year, unless there's like one in November and that was Not one that just appealed to me, I guess, so. so now I I'm really interested to Dig on this so you tell me about anything leading up to your first 100? What that experience was like, yeah, just slow down a little and go back to this first 100? Yeah. And how old are you at this point?
[00:12:28] Hunter: I was 19, I think.
[00:12:31] Tayson: Okay, so 19 you sign up for 100. Miler how much time do you have to train? Or did you do any training?
[00:12:36] Hunter: So I finished Eco challenge in September end of September and I basically, I just want to recover, I don't want to do anything, so I didn't put on any running shoes for like, until Christmas time basically. And I found this hundred Miler that was like three weeks later. I'm like, oh, I think I'm recovered enough. I should go try it out like I think it's just like blind optimism. I have for everything I do is like I've done Eco challenge of do all these long adventurous. I know how to I run 100 mi in these Adventures but it's kind of broken up into like, 50 Mi chunks. And I was like, I think I could do this hundred. So I went into it, I signed up and I was like, I don't need to train. Let me just recover and just show up to start line without doing any training. And that's what I did. I showed up and oh, it was, it was again, super painful. It was the first 50 miles went great. And then it was like, my legs start hurting in a way, they never they'll before, like, cramping up and like really tight knees, and all this stuff where, like adventure racing. The cool thing about is, yeah, you'll like, 50 miles and some sections are a hug a mile. I was but mainly hiking and then you switch to bike and you can rest on a bike and then you switch to paddle and then you switch back to the bike. You kind of Switched disciplines where I found out really quick that ultra running that pounding, just one sport. Makes everything so much harder for me. So yeah, it was a pretty miserable experience and I cried and my dad was there and he was like he's always there for all my Adventures but this one he was just pacing me for like 20 miles and he's like what what's wrong with you Hunter? You're like a completely different. Poor person, you're like crying and complaining and as it was just a whole miserable experience but from that it was like I realized like I grow as a person, when put outside my comfort zone and adventure racing. I got so comfortable. Even during Eco-Challenge, all these tough races. I felt comfortable in ultra running. 100 miles was like way outside my comfort zone, and I learned so much about myself and that's what hooked me.
[00:14:36] Tayson: Yeah. So on that race, what race was? It
[00:14:40] Hunter: was a Long Haul 100 down in Florida.
[00:14:42] Tayson: Okay? That's yeah, that's interesting. So
[00:14:48] Hunter: really flat and easy. Of course. And it killed.
[00:14:51] Tayson: It is. Okay, that's what I was actually wondering. But like was there a time cut off or anything like that or were you well under the Off or did that? Yeah, that become a factor.
[00:15:01] Hunter: The cutoff was 32 hours and I finished in like 30 hours I think.
[00:15:06] Tayson: Okay.
[00:15:07] Hunter: So I think that what became a factor where I was like, oh, I know, I can knock out a hundred miles, but 32 hours at the time felt so hard and like man run that fast. So
[00:15:16] Tayson: mm-hmm. Yeah, that's that's wild. So see do this, you realize, you know, just how much more difficult it is or it's different sport, different, different elements, different struggles, right? Are you much of like a like a Backpacker at all? Or is it mainly just sticking to ultra running and in these Adventures
[00:15:38] Hunter: Yeah, I I consider myself a Backpacker for years because adventure racing, that's really what we're doing like. Some of these big efforts, you're 100 miles, completely unsupported. So we had to carry like 30 pound 40, pound backpack, sometimes. And then, especially if we talk about the last TV shows on. That was what we talk about that later. But
[Editor’s note: The preceding childhood-age, father-son racing, checkpoint/navigation, championship, world-record, Eco-Challenge, television, Fiji, youngest-finisher, and first-100-mile discussion—including Hunter’s and Tayson’s ages, preparation and training, Long Haul 100 and Florida identity, cutoff, finish time, and pack context—are March 2024 participant speech. They are not independently verified records or event/show status, and they are not youth-sport, age, endurance, navigation, training, performance, pacing, nutrition, hydration, or medical guidance or instructions.]
[00:15:56] Tayson: is that? Yeah, yeah, so you Do this 100 Miler and you also start to get into like Expeditions, right? And what what age or when was your first expedition?
[00:16:11] Hunter: Um yeah, so I did that 100 miler. And I, I jump full force and it like crazy FKTs and stuff because it was like, okay, I did 100 miles what's next. Instead of what most people think is like, okay, I did a hundred miles, I barely survived. Let me just try to keep perfecting 100, Miler. I was like, oh next one is 300 miles so I ran a 300 mile ultra marathon and almost died from that too. But
[00:16:32] Tayson: you're in a 300 mile ultra marathon.
[00:16:34] Hunter: Yeah so
[00:16:35] Tayson: goodness
[00:16:36] Hunter: like a year later. I think I tackled the 300-mile Benton MacKaye fastest-known time which is like one of the gnarliest trailers in the country, it goes from the Smoky Mountains. All the way down to Springer Mountain Georgia. It's like 72,000 feet of elevation gain it's just so gnarly and I went into that with almost no training. It was just again. My training is always been like I do these Big Adventures and it trains me for the next thing it just constantly Training from a race to race to race. I went into that was like, oh, I'm just gonna wing it and I ended up finishing it, but it was again a really tough experience. And did you set the fastest-known time? Then we did. Yeah. Set the fastest-known time for that. And again, that was something where I went into it. So blind, it was like, again, blind optimism was like, that's what gets me to start line of these things. Like you would get so, like, like scared and intimidated by the big goal, and you won't even do it for me. It's like, I'd rather go into it blindly Optimist, and then show up and start line. And then, yeah, if the race is horrible, at least, I started that that's more of its success for me, than me, worrying about it and over planning and stuff. So, yeah, I showed that 300 miles and went into was like, oh, I think I'm Gonna Knock this down like, four and a half days or so, and it took me six days and I beat the record by only like five hours or something like that, but got it done.
[00:17:53] Tayson: I think that's I think that's really interesting though, right? Like you're very optimistic, I think on your Instagram account, like in the bio is like, every day. You're alive is the best day ever like that. That's like a lot of optimism. You've also built confidence through these races, that you've done and then I'm so, like, I guess what I'm wondering is. It seems like you've built a very tough mental strength, right? And, and there's a whole, there's a whole thing around that, right? Like, there's people that for sure are stronger, physically than they are mentally. I'm sure and but there's others that can, that can tap into a different place, you know, and just get to a different, you know, I'm in physical pain or I'm in this, but I can keep going. In fact, one of, you know, just the absolute Legend Courtney Dauwalter. I think that that's like her superpowers, her optimism, right? Like she goes and does things. Like she's a she's just an incredibly gifted athlete. But at the same time as like, is it her athleticism, or is it her like crazy optimism that she seems to have and be able to like go into the the most painful situation and just stay optimistic. For you as like, you think about that for yourself? Like how much do you feel like training and athleticism as a part of your achievements versus something else?
[00:19:16] Hunter: Yeah, I think I always say I'm nothing special like, physically. I don't think I'm the fittest person ever. He go on Instagram. There's ways that are guys than me, but I feel like the experience I've had. And again, I realized so much on my mental strength, like, doing hundreds of Adventure races, and all these ultra marathons builds up that mental fortitude. That like, anything that's thrown at me. I think I can make it through or survive. And I think that's what I rely on at all these things. Even if I show up to start line, not not trained fully and not feeling fresh. I know, I can rely on my mindset to push me through that. I've always wanted to be that athlete, that could really be thrown into any situation and make it through and it's not going to be the fastest. It's not gonna be the prettiest but I'll make it through it and that's why it's like Look at other athletes, some top Runners that are like, so gifted. Physically. I feel like I know, mentally, they're strong too, but something goes wrong with them. In a Ultra or something like their crew forgets to give them a gel. And it's like all of a sudden, the whole race is destroying. They're crying and they're they quit the rates and it's like I never wanted to be that athlete. I wanted to be the athlete where I can show up for 50 miles in my crew. Misses me all five crew stops I'll be perfectly fine. I'm gonna make it through somehow just rely on my inner strength to go through so yeah.
[Editor’s note: The preceding Benton MacKaye, 300-mile, fastest-known-time, pace, training, fitness, mental-strength, crew, fueling, and performance statements are individual historical claims. They do not establish current records, a safe preparation level, or endurance, pacing, crew, nutrition, or training guidance.]
[00:20:30] Tayson: Have you ever dnf'd something?
[00:20:32] Hunter: I have there was been Think like, two races, I dnf one. Was I should have dnf'd about 10 hours earlier, but again, there's tricky thing with the mindset, there's so many layers to building up your mental strength is like I got in this doing all these crazy races. I was like I never gonna quit a race that's like there's never a reason I should quit erase unless I'm gonna die and it's like you listen. The David Goggins, and that's what he
[00:21:06] Tayson: said, right?
[00:21:07] Hunter: But then, it could be very dangerous when you could actually die. So, like I had a Adventure Race where I was white water rafting, my boat flipped and I got a concussion and dislocated my arm and a thought of quitting, never came across my mind. I hopped out of the boat, got my bike and instantly kept racing and my teammates, like Hunter. We should stop your arms, like, little a dislocated. You have a concussion, you can't see him like, no, I'm not quitting pushing to the pain. And I went for like another eight hours, throwing up, blacking out, like shiting myself everything and eventually the Medics pulled me from the race. But looking back on the experience, I thought that was me being tough. But that was me being weak. That was the hardest thing from me to do in that situation was to stop and I wasn't willing to stop. It was the easy thing for me to do in races is just keep pushing through but there comes a point where you need to realize. It's like you can't push through everything. So I dnf that raise and I dnf'd another race. Actually last year. I was coming off this big 50-state summit world-record attempt and like the next two weeks late, I was like, I feel great and let me go. Try 100 mile and got super-bad altitude sickness and had to pull out of the race? But so no matter how strong mentally you are, there is comes the limit where it's not worth dying for.
[Editor’s note: The preceding DNF, concussion, dislocated-arm, impaired-vision, vomiting, blackout, altitude-sickness, and delayed-stopping account is preserved as historical speech, not medical or emergency guidance. Injury, neurological symptoms, impaired consciousness, or serious illness require appropriate professional evaluation; toughness does not make continued participation safe.]
[00:22:18] Tayson: Right. Right. Yeah, I think that there's, it's still just blows me away though that you can in a lot of ways, show up to some of these races in the past, just cold, turkey. Not, you know, just out of the blue and finish them. I think it says a lot of what the human body can do. And and, you know, and some people like that just isn't possible. Probably like physically or the base level of Fitness, they have like that just would not be possible, but for other people, you know, it is and you're, you're proven that right? It's that it really can be mind over matter. In a lot of these situations. I also think that your approach of like I'm here to finish probably has helped you in a lot of ways of like not going out too fast, too strong and like creating massive issues that just come back and It's destroy you later in the race, right?
[00:23:10] Hunter: Yeah.
[00:23:11] Tayson: Um, but that that's actually what made me decide that I thought I could do 100 miles. I was pacing guy by the name of Jeff Pelletier in the Moab 240. And I was like, man, I can hold this pace for 100 Mi, you know, but I was like, but I've never, I've never gone this slow in a race, you know what I mean? It's just got like the little sort of like okay maybe if I trained well enough and I, you know, slowed myself down enough in the beginning and some of those things, then maybe this would be a reality. So we'll see. Yeah.
[00:23:41] Hunter: It's very interesting thing. Pacing somebody for these things because it's like, again, I had that thought too. You're running with a friend. You're like man, I think I can hold this for X many hours or X Mini miles and it's like I should go sign up my own race. And I made that mistake where I was pacing a friend for his FKT and I paced him for 150 Mi consistently and I was like, man, I feel like a great shape. I'm gonna go after this record next year. He told me he was, and it was like a completely different experience. When you're the one in the fight, when you're pacing somebody, it's something about like your mindset is so focused on them and taking care of them, that you don't realize. Oh, man, I'm actually really sore right now, but I can't, I can't complain because I get worse than I am. Yeah. But when you're the one in the fight and you're starting to suffer at like mile 50 in your legs hurt, you can complain about that and it kind of like, makes it way harder, but I think just I think you should have the confidence going into your 100 mile or that you could do it your body's capable of it. Like I I often do the mindset of like, Okay? You signed for 100-miler, how do you feel, do you think you could do 200 miles when you get to that finish line? If somebody told you put a gun against your head and it's like you gotta go on another 100 miles, you do that and most of the time for me it's like yeah I could so it's like going in that into the rates. I think with confidence that you could do double the distance if you had to
[00:25:01] Tayson: yeah. Now that's that's so true, though, about pacing because I remember like when I was pacing him, someone got to the end of like, how do you feel? How do you? And I and I literally like, stopped and thought I'm like, I don't know. I haven't thought once about how I feel, I just know that I don't feel as bad as him right now, you know?
[00:25:17] Hunter: Yeah.
[00:25:17] Tayson: He's got an extra this, many miles on me. And like, I've just only been in the headspace of like, you know, trying to to move move him along as efficiently as I can. And, man, this, this climb is tough. I wonder how he's feeling, you know, just like I never stopped to think about how I was really feeling but Like, I was, I remember, I was like, being very conscious to like keep fluids and nutrition and stuff in me, so I didn't become a problem. But like, it was, no, I wasn't in the headspace of worrying about myself. And so that's interesting. That'll be interesting to see how that that changes on this 100 Miler but
[00:25:49] Hunter: curious how we can Implement that into our own races. Like, do we get a Pacer that's like, way out of shape and we have to take care of them the whole time. I might actually work
[Editor’s note: The preceding gun-to-the-head analogy, doubling-distance, finishing-capacity, pacing, discomfort, mental-confidence, and proposed out-of-shape-pacer statements are rhetorical historical March 2024 opinions, including the final pacer tactic. They are not a safe decision rule, coercive advice, a capacity or performance guarantee, or endurance or pacing instruction.]
[00:25:59] Tayson: And imaginary friend. I'll go to that headspace when it's middle of the night and I'm gonna be hallucinating or something, you know? So, so I wanted to come back though, because you've also done Expeditions so, talk to me a little bit about what Expeditions you've done. And just the difference is like what? What is it like to do an expedition style race? You know what? I don't know. Like, I guess, yeah. I would imagine that most people listening to this just are not familiar with them. So we'd love to hear what that's what that's like going into those and just being out there.
[00:26:36] Hunter: know I've done a bunch of expeditions that's that's what I find the most enjoyment because it's not like a set race and it's not Something that you're signing up for of, like there's a lot of unknown of like, is this even Paul? Possible. So that like me so the two biggest Expedition I've done the past two years with Um, in sit, 18 teams of two we and
[00:27:08] Tayson: you cut out there for a second. Um, so I must connection on stable. Oh. But no you started with no is it? Now I don't talk about 30 the back about 30 seconds if you would
[00:27:25] Hunter: So in 2020, I got casted for a TV show called Race to Survive: Alaska, and it's on Peacock. You can go watch it. But the premise was eight teams of two got dropped off in Alaska with no food limited gear and we had to raise hundreds of miles across Alaska for like 40 days. So like quick,
[00:27:43] Tayson: they give you bear spray or a weapon.
[00:27:46] Hunter: They gave us bear spray, but when dealing with big Grizzlies, you kind of want to shotgun with you. So I teamed up with my dad, I brought him out of retirement. He was like, done with adventuring dad. This great opportunity. Let's go do this TV show together would be so much fun. It was a lot of fun, but a lot of suffering, but it was basically the most extreme Expedition I could ever think of, whereas, basically, like the team the show alone but moving So, again, we were there with no real food, they gave us some like canned clams and canned mussels in the premise was again, we had a race 100s of miles across the state and like hunt for our own food. Forage fish like no tents, nothing. It's just like we had a little tarp. We had to share before something days
[00:28:35] Tayson: go through some of the gear like what gear do they give you for this?
[00:28:38] Hunter: So they gave us a gear list. It was like 100 items you could just choose from but they didn't tell you exactly what. So I went, this is what I discovered ultralight, backpacking. This, when I came across your company, but I basically was like, what's the best ultralight gear possible, and research at all, and every little outside measured on little measuring scales and everything. I went full and ultralight, backpacking. And I was like, this is what's going to make a break this race. If what hauling around 56 pound packs, we're gonna break our knees and drop out of this race. So I was adamant on we have to get the lightest packs possible but at the same time the mandatory gear requires axes and these big pots and like All the stuff like bows and fishing rods. All this stuff. That's really heavy. So, everything outside to be ultra light. so, I had A really good backpacks tarps. We had one tarp per team, and it wasn't like, you could have duplicates of everything, you couldn't have like two tarps. You couldn't have a tent, you couldn't have a stove because they wanted to make it survivor based the only real luxury item was that one tarp That we'd sleep underneath every night, but everything else. We're gonna make fires. You couldn't use the lighter. You can't use anything, it's just a ferro rod. But the whole premise of the show was, it was funny. We showed up the start line and my pack weight. I think, Wade, like 25 pounds, which is quite Quite heavy and ultralight standard, but when you have a big pot and axes and fishing rods, all the stuff we were. So ultralight like everybody else was 40, 50, 60 pound packs, one of the teams had 70 pounds,
[00:30:09] Tayson: no
[00:30:10] Hunter: 70 pound pack. Like in we're not like hiking along a nice paved path or anything, like we didn't step foot on a single Trail or road for 40 days. It was all Bush racking through the 40 days, 40 days, the thickest Alaskan jungle ever and these people have 70 pound packs hopping over logs. I'm like I can't even imagine it was hard enough for 25 pound packs.
[00:30:32] Tayson: What part of Alaska. Did they drop you in all different parts?
[00:30:36] Hunter: We started in Ketchikan which is the south east corner. It's basically like a rainforest and they took us Kodiak Island which were already freaked out by Grizzlies. We're seeing Grizzlies every day.
[00:30:48] Tayson: Yeah, let's just take you to the island. Totally Infested by the biggest grizzly bears in the world. Okay.
[00:30:53] Hunter: And here's one little bear spray here. Yeah, and The funny thing is, so they gave us no food. Except these, like, emergency rations like every week. They would give us like 500 calories to live off of her whole week.
[00:31:07] Tayson: No,
[00:31:07] Hunter: it was just in case. We didn't catch any fish or anything, but he would give us like canned clams with, like the smelliest greasiest oil. So, like, you open this up and now all your gears covered in this like, bear attractant, like
[00:31:21] Tayson: It was crazy. Clearly, the guy thinking of that was not in the field.
[00:31:24] Hunter: Yeah, it was, it was funny. So then we went the Kodiak Island. The most densely populated bear Island the entire world. I think was like, one Grizzly per square mile. So it's super
[00:31:36] Tayson: they're known to be the biggest Grizzlies in the world or Coastal brown bears, right? There's huge, huge bears. Okay, and
[00:31:43] Hunter: then we finish on Cordova which is on the mainland with like typical Alaska when you think of Alaska think these big mountains but like Alaska's, so diverse, we have rainforests Kodiak, Island felt like Hawaii to me. It was so beautiful. And then like, Cordova was the jagged glacier peaks and everything so it was a wide variety of everything,
[00:32:01] Tayson: okay. So so in this, you're trying to travel destination to destination. What, you got a paper map compass this gear, what do you mainly eating?
[00:32:15] Hunter: So again, they gave us these emergency rations, which were not good, not many calories. You couldn't live off that. So you had to be basically the whole time, we're like foraging for food while we're racing, we're non-stop like looking for mushrooms and blueberries, and like cutting through bushes and carrying these blueberry branches and like just eating, blueberries, the whole time, all these different things and like fishing was a big thing, we caught like maybe 20 fish. All different types. No salmon, unfortunately. Like we're in Alaska. You think this gonna be these big salmon. We got these little, like rockfish.
[00:32:48] Tayson: Yeah,
[00:32:49] Hunter: what we do for clams and mussels but over that 40 days, I lost 25 pounds and my dad lost 35 pounds.
[00:33:00] Tayson: Goodness,
[00:33:02] Hunter: So it's like you're 40 days. Yeah.
[00:33:05] Tayson: That is.
[00:33:08] Hunter: Skinny guy to lose that much weight. So, I was like, fragile, my dad looked like Tom Hanks in Cast Away. It was hilarious. But it was crazy thing about this expedition was Not only was the mileage crazy and like the terrain we were going through but we were also starving, so like you're so weak. I used to like hiking app, play some chair and non-stop, eating Backpacker meals and all the stuff, but like this, we're like bushwack so weak. No muscle is like crazy Expedition.
[00:33:35] Tayson: It's crazy hard mentally, too, right? Because like, it's one thing to just be able to plug into a trail and just go, right?
[00:33:43] Hunter: Yep.
[00:33:44] Tayson: It's another thing when you are trying to navigate trying to use Mental energy, which you, which your brain like will start to shut off, right? It starts to try to limit resources and calorie burn. Anyway, it can your body and and then, you know, but then you get to a spot where it's like there's just no easy way to cross this. And I've got nothing in the gas tank. It's not like you can just plug onto a trail. Turn your brain off and just Cruise, right? It's that sounds. Incredibly challenging to me. I feel like we're.
[00:34:11] Hunter: Yeah,
[00:34:12] Tayson: I'll go ahead.
[00:34:12] Hunter: There's so many layers to that like that show was Yes, there was no set trailer or anything, so we're navigating by map and compass every single step forward non-stop looking. And then the aspect that was starving and that were carrying these big backpacks. But there's also, this is TV show so those camera Crews filming us this whole time. Interviewing this, how you guys feeling and we're just, like, dying here. Like, oh, feeling great. Yeah, try to be an entertaining for TV while suffering and then also for 40 days, we had no connection to the outside world. So we had no phones, no satellite devices. We couldn't even like text. My mom be like, Mom, I'm really struggling right now. I'm in the tent, like starving and suffering, all alone. So there's some aspects to that, where I, it's hard to compare that expedition to anything else I've ever done.
[00:35:00] Tayson: What was the biggest thing you learned from that 40 days?
[00:35:04] Hunter: Yeah, biggest thing was Looking at all the other competitors on the show. So this was a competition, we were fighting for a half a million dollars, so like everybody's competitive, but which I just gotta say,
[00:35:16] Tayson: I gotta say this because we just interviewed another guy that did the two guys that did The Amazing Race and that's competing for a million. And I think it's such a time commitment, even a half a million That's not enough money, man. That's not enough money. Like go like, oh my gosh, that's anyways, go on sorry.
[00:35:33] Hunter: And that's a perfect transition because that's what like a lot of competitors on the show was saying, just like this is not worth it. I could be back at home making not as much money, but making good money and not starving, not suffering. But in that moment, I realized my dad and I would like, we would be paying a half million dollars for this experience. It's like we might be messed up for this. But this is what we love this. What we do back at home, like if somebody told me to put on a backpack and go hike across that place now is with no food or anything. I would go do that. That sounds fun. So it's like, from that moment we're looking around, it's like everybody was like complaining and suffering and it was super tough like the thing ever and I had low too, but I was just so grateful to be there. And at the end, I was so grateful to be alive that like halfway through this thing, I would wake up. Completely starving hurting so bad, from the day before, but I was like crying because I was so happy to Be alive. And that's where my bio came from was like, every day alive is the best day ever. Where I would wake up even though I had no food, it was completely raining. I was starving, I was crying because I was so happy to be breathing. So I got to a point in that show, where it was like, from that moment, it's like every single day after this, no matter how bad the day is, no matter how many things go wrong, I could still be happy that I'm still breathing. So that was my biggest takeaway from that entire show.
[00:36:49] Tayson: Yeah, I'm gonna have to go watch the show, it sounds right up my alley because like the idea of like, this, like alone, people always ask me if you've seen Alone. Have you seen Alone? Like, I've watched a few episodes but like, it never, it never pulled me in, but this would be I think just yeah, it sounds really interesting to me. There's so much more Dynamic. I feel like going on there. Would you say that this was harder than Eco-Challenge?
[00:37:14] Hunter: Oh yeah, this was way tough for the Eco challenge. It was a different. Tough Eco challenge was like physically all out for 12 days.
[00:37:22] Tayson: Yeah.
[00:37:23] Hunter: And I'm Only Sleeping for like one hour a night with this. Yeah. This this was a completely different. Like mental thing. It wasn't as physically demanding in the sense of like my legs weren't tired every night because we're not doing big mileage and we'll only be moving for X many hours a day. But it's just mentally being 40, 50 days off the grid, starving, no Comfort items. No connection outside world. That was really tough. Yeah, was by far the toughest
[00:37:50] Tayson: It was there. Any pieces of gear or anything that stuck out to you in that as being? Just like this was the piece of gear that saved my life or this.
[00:38:01] Hunter: I think there's so many great pieces of gear. I'm just okay. Again, I went through so much and I got to partner with a lot of great brands that gave me a lot of the gear but one of the underrated pieces of gear that I had was there was no tents allowed on this show. They were really adamant about that. Only a tarp you can't do anything else but a tarp but I was like well going to Alaska Alaska is known for like really bad mosquitoes. We're sleeping on this tarp, my dad and I were going to be swarmed by mosquitoes and yeah wearing a bug. Net is one thing but when the bug Nets against your face, they get seen right through it. So I was like what can we do about this? So I found this like bug tarp thingy. This big bug tarp. So I had the my main tarp and I had this bug Draper over it and it protect us completely from mosquitoes and like it made all the other teams jealous because they're waking up with all these mosquito bites on their face and we were in there perfectly clean, in what we called our Taj Mahal
[00:39:02] Tayson: That's awesome. That's awesome. Yeah. I was thinking like fishing pole or something like that, but bugs are so bad in Alaska, that makes perfect sense. Yeah. Um, so yeah, for sure. I'm gonna have to go check that out on. You says on Peacock right?
[00:39:19] Hunter: Yep.
[Editor’s note: The preceding Race to Survive: Alaska account—including the final repeated and confirmed Peacock/show-status statement—contains historical participant claims about streaming/show status, competition, bears, bear spray, firearms, pack weight, tarp, fire, food, foraging, fishing, weight loss, off-trail travel, navigation, communications, camera crew, mosquitoes, and gear. It does not establish current streaming status, wildlife safety, lawful firearm practice, safe pack weight, shelter, fire, food, weight-loss, route, navigation, isolation, or equipment instructions; exact conditions and product details were not independently verified. The preserved phrase about hiking and a chair remains unclear and has not been converted into a product, terrain, or activity claim.]
[00:39:20] Tayson: Okay. And I didn't even know. So at any point did you ever get into like, actually dialing in? Because you've done some FKTs now, you've done some other things now and I imagine it's just kind of getting more competitive or maybe you're getting more competitive with things. So at any point did you start to really focus on training or nutrition or hydration or anything like that?
[00:39:45] Hunter: Particularly just this past year. 2023 was the first year that I actually like took training, seriously, you know, it's like okay, I'm already at the top ranks of adventure racing, so I'm doing really good in these ultras and FKTs. I needed to start taking this more serious and said just like relying. Only on the mindset. I feel like I build up my mindset enough that like now I can start dialing in other things where talking back with talking about Courtney. A lot of people look at Courtney. And all these top athletes and they're so fixated on the little 1% improvements they can make like oh what's the shoes? All right, what's the running shorts? They use what's the best and it's like gear is important and all those things are important to make you a better athlete. But those are like the one to 10% improvements people neglect, the like 80% of it. 90% of it is just your mindset. People don't want to improve that. That's too hard. They look for the easy fix this. So, I finally got the points. Like, okay, I got the mindset. I feel like now I need to work on the fitness. The training part and then the gear and everything. So that's why I was last year. I started really fine tuning, the gear, but yeah. Basically this past year, I've been doing the Focus on the training. And that's why I basically went into this. We could talk about it, but the 50-states world-record attempt really highly trained, and everything and we were able to knock that out.
[00:41:04] Tayson: So, leading up to that, what is your training look like? What do you like to focus on?
[00:41:10] Hunter: It's not super. Structured because again the sport, I do like I'm not just Ultra Runner Runner. I'm not just adventurous, I'm not just mountain biker, like I do all those different sports and try to at a top level hopefully, and it's like, My training is again, doing these big efforts back to back. Because again my Adventures change all the time where I just finished a 1100 mile run across Florida. That was I was running two marathons every single day. So that type of training is way different from even 100 Miler that I'm trying to run fast. That's different from the adventure-racing national championships. That's all out Sprint for 24 hours so I try to keep it as flexible as possible, but if I can get in a few big workouts like every other week, I'm happy with that and then just in between a lot of my training isn't that long like it's sub one hour runs really fast interval workouts and said of I realized I have the fitness, I have endurance to go on forever. To get the biggest gains from me is to do these really short fast workouts which is counter counterintuitive for endurance athlete. You would think oh just been a lot of time on your feet but it's me like I'm in the gym a lot doing Upper body workouts, I'm doing hill repeats. I'm doing intervals, I'm trying to do like, a lot of high heart rate stuff with some big efforts every other week or so.
[00:42:31] Tayson: Yeah. Do you stay like, like, do you ride, your mountain bike, consistently, just for fun or things like that, that you're not considering working out or training.
[00:42:42] Hunter: Yeah, everything's fine for me like training wise. I never, again I don't stick to a really structured. I have a coach and everything but like if I go off the plan like 50% of the time because it's like, oh, I want to go just ride my bike for fun? My friend invited me out to go buy a bike. I'm not gonna say no to that like yeah, because again, I rely on a lot of my mindset to perform at the top level instead of hey, I need to be super structured my training because I see like, I got to a point where I was like, if I want to be a professional athlete, I basically need to be dormant for an entire year. I need to be in one location not doing any Adventures. I need to be training every single day. Exactly what my coach tells me to do and that just wasn't the life. I wanted to have, like I want to be able to go hike that place and chair. Whenever I want. I want to go caving. I want to go mountain biking and that's I've built my life around adventures and if I was fully focused on training to be the best athlete ever, I think I would be pretty depressed.
[00:43:34] Tayson: yeah, well I guess I was I was just Considering the fact that like, if you're doing when you are working out, if you're doing like interval training, hill-repeat work like that. That would give you a really good for your buck. If you're all being active, just in your everyday life doing like the, the lower heart rate lower intensity, but you're still getting a lot of time in that, right? So that's still like solid training. Okay. I go to my Sprint work out, or whatever. And then I come back and I'm just You know still mountain biking every other day just for fun. It's it's not a workout, it's just fun but it's like you're getting that time you're getting that so I can see how that that's really effective. What about for like nutrition. So you mentioned briefly about your what you say 1100 miles across Florida. What are you typically doing for nutrition? Do you just have a gut of steel or do you do you dial that stuff into
[00:44:26] Hunter: Um I I used to just eat whatever I want. So adventuring again. It's all about it,
[00:44:34] Tayson: kind of remind me of an interview that we've had that set the PCT FKT. And he was like, oh yeah, I 12,000 calories a day. 3,000 calories in gummies, 3,000 calories, and bar 3,000 calories and nuts, three times, you know, it's just like the most random stuff all the time, but it was like like he literally ate 3000 calories a day of just Fat snacks and gummy bears and stuff like that. So and I feel like this is, like I'm having the same feeling of what you're about to say, but we'll see.
[00:45:03] Hunter: Oh, so little twist on it, but because it really depends on a venture like whatever you're doing, it needs to be tailored. If I'm doing like adventurous National Championship where it's like all out, 24-hour Sprint race. Basically, I need to be super dialed with my food. I need to have everything laid out and you need to be eating 250 calories an hour. I'm very scientific about that, but when it comes to like something like the 1100 Mi Florida Trail FKT, I just did, I'm like burning so many calories. I'm eating 12,000 calories every single day. And it's like you can't eat 12,000 calories of healthy stuff you because you're eating a salad that's like 300 calories. I need to be eating like donuts smoothies that are like 2000 calories in one sip. so I work out to eat honestly, because that's yeah, that's So in adventure is saying I I started out as a kid like doing these races where we would come across gas stations. And if you're like a super dialed scientific athlete, you come to gas station. There's nothing there. You could eat without your stomach going south. But I adapted my body to like I can go to a gas station and go get hot dogs off the rollers, I could go get milkshake. I could go get ice cream. I could go get the expired little tacos at the stand, like, I could eat anything and still keep going. So I became adaptive with that. But once I started taking ultra running a little bit more serious, I was like, okay, I need to be somewhat dialed or I could still play around a little bit, eat pizza and stuff, but I need to have some sort of a plan.
[00:46:31] Tayson: Gotcha. Yeah, so in those in those One races that you're aiming 250 calories. Now are getting getting pretty scientific
[Editor’s note: The preceding 2023 training, coaching, fitness, interval, hill-repeat, heart-rate, cross-training, 250-calorie-per-hour, 12,000-calorie-per-day, gas-station-food, gut-tolerance, and nutrition statements—including the final repeated 250-calorie target—are historical participant speech. They are not current nutrition, training, hydration, weight, fueling, or medical guidance or prescriptions and should not be generalized to another person or event.]
[00:46:39] Tayson: but so let's jump back for just a second to your summiting project, the highest peaks in the lower 48 in every state. Yeah,
[00:46:50] Hunter: so yeah,
[00:46:51] Tayson: I'll go ahead. Yeah. What was that? Like
[00:46:52] Hunter: it, we were going after the all 50 states, highest mountains in record time. So the fastest, The Climb Every Single Peak up and down the record is 43 days. So that was what we're trying to beat. So it was funny I got invited to that project a month before I had zero mountaineering experience. Like I'm this crazy endurance athlete and adventure and Ultra Runner, but I had no mountaineering experience. But my adventure-racing friend who used to race back in the day. He went off to become this world-class Mountaineer, climbed Everest and the Seven Summits and everything in a month before. He was like, hey Hunter, I love what you're doing, a social media, you want to come film this thing for us. I'm like, you know, I have no experience. He's like, oh no, I know you're mentally, tough, you'll figure it out. So like, okay. So the first Mountain I go to was Denali like,
[00:47:39] Tayson: oh my God,
