[00:00:00] Tayson: Everybody, welcome back to the Live Ultralight Podcast, powered by Outdoor Vitals. This is another episode of Ask OV or myself and Brigham. Our lead designer, come on, to answer your questions. We this is our third time. I believe doing this. We're doing this once a month right now and it's just an opportunity for you guys to really get your direct questions answered from those of us on the team that I guess this isn't really arguably, but spend the most time testing out in the field. Most nights outside most familiar with their products. And so it's a good to get opportunity to just ask a bunch of questions. So today we do have new questions
[00:00:39] Tayson: to be answered, and these are actually questions that have come in, so we'll dive into those. But in the meantime, it's trying to think of if there's anything to catch up on since we, we met last I'm pretty excited. I do have a packrafting trip, but I'm headed out on tomorrow, so I'm gonna hike into Grand Canyon and packraft down the Colorado for a handful miles and then hike back out. So, that'll be a new adventure for me that I'm super stoked to go and give a shot. Brigham. You've been out doing a lot of miles seems like, you're, you're getting ahead of me on some training, for our upcoming, our R3 attempt, but
[00:01:17] Tayson: other than that anything yeah, a lot of miles. Uh
[00:01:21] Brigham: no nothing that we have. I mean we did a trip recap from That trip a couple weeks ago. Yeah, nothing not worthy. Really? Yeah.
[00:01:33] Tayson: Product design goes on so. Yep. Well diving to this and I will call out a couple things as we go on, but we've got the questions are building and I don't know that we can answer all these. We do keep these more more short and a little more informal. These are these are we try to keep these at 30 minute episodes. So we'll try to just jump right in and just continue to answer your questions. If you do have questions or questions that you think of throughout the course of this, jump over to our website and just open up a chat there or or submit a ticket to support or email and just say, you
[00:02:11] Tayson: know, this is a question for the podcast and they'll get that question over to us. So really, really simple to send over her question and, and continue to send these in. We definitely can't get to all of them. And some of these questions, all kind of make notes on us in terms of I don't know, sometimes we get questions that I'm probably we're gonna try to steer you away from continuing to ask these types of questions because they'll get really repetitive really fast. We really hope that this turns into more of a program where you guys can can dig into technical aspects or preferences of backpacking or why we specifically choose to like today. Use
[00:02:49] Tayson: certain cook systems, so with that helpful thing, like, yeah, yeah, things will help.
[00:02:55] Brigham: Everybody enjoy or be more effective, or more efficient. And some way improve their experience out there. Backpacking. That's kind of like Our passion, that's what we build the gear to do and so hard, feelings. If we don't get, get all of them answered. Yeah, we won't be able
[00:03:13] Tayson: to every questions but I did specifically today. I wanted to get to as many questions as we could. So should somebody will be kind of more quick,
Editor’s note: The question-submission workflow describes March 2025 practice. Use current official contact options if submitting a question now; no generic homepage or support link is included here.
[00:03:21] Tayson: but I wanted to open up with this one for Marcus. he's asking about, Pots and why we use certain ones. So you said you know, which do you prefer and why you got a titanium pot, and his approximate weight was 116 grams, or four ounces or an aluminum heat-exchanger pot, approximately 170 grams, or six ounces. Is, is it better to have a heat? Exchanger is it worth the extra weight in your opinion? before I directly answer that, I didn't want to say this, I wasn't sure where he got those weights from, because Like the pot that I use from TOAKS, a titanium pot is 2.6 ounces for a 550 mL. So it's
[00:04:06] Tayson: quite a bit lighter than the four ounces. And then I also tried to go look for like a heat-exchanger pot. Quickly, I didn't I didn't do ton of digging but six ounces would be quite light for a heat-exchanger, I actually, I think I know
[00:04:20] Brigham: kind of where this question is coming from. its kind of a side discussion, but you know, kind of I think a lot of people are familiar with a media bias or censorship and the media feeding us with what they want to see. Well, the same thing often exists in the world of YouTube and backpacking gear. You start to see the same aluminum heat-exchanger pot being reviewed in the same three to six month window by five to 10 YouTube channels. This is I suspect this is kind of that case there's a little aluminum pot that's kind of trending right now and you know, a lot of YouTube channels are talking about it, so that So
[00:05:04] Brigham: yeah. A lot of similarities. Yeah, yeah. Six ounces is, it is very light for a heat-exchanger pot, but Yeah, it's a good. yeah, you know, four ounces is probably Again maybe that's maybe he's referring to a more like a 700 or 750 mL titanium pot because I know like I have one of those as well and it's closer to four ounces but it's not what I use most of the time. So
[00:05:27] Tayson: yeah. Yeah I have the 750 as well. I would be surprised though if it wasn't just like barely cracking over three ounces. So yeah. Um, so for the sake of this I would almost My opinion on this would be that you're going to say, three ounces or or another word, you're almost doubling the weight to go to heat-exchanger pot. So I started off with the heat-exchangers years and years ago, I really liked Jetboils. I had a Jetboil and I bought some alternative like, cheaper Jetboils and I would just use them with a regular stove. Not the actual like Jetboil screw on, you know, adapter stove. And so I, I started in that
[00:06:06] Tayson: neck of the woods, but as I tried to get lighter and lighter, it just became more and more apparent. That was a huge challenge because I could make an extremely light cook system, using a titanium pot And then to add on to that a little bit too. And I haven't done a bunch of testing with this. I have watched a lot of videos where people do testing with this. I've done maybe one test with this myself.
[00:06:30] Tayson: Yes, a heat-exchanger pot. Absolutely boils faster but I did I have not found that. There is enough of a payoff to justify the extra weight. Because, even if you just look at it from, from this sense of it, three ounces, three ounces. I use an alcohol stove, quite a lot. Three ounces of fuel, boils an additional three cups of water, right? So, like that thing has to literally be in this case, like twice as efficient for it to make sense and I haven't found them to be that much more efficient. Now I've seen length of trip and there's there's a lot of things that can Factor this. But is it, is it in terms
[00:07:12] Tayson: of this? I find that I still like to just use a titanium pot. They're smaller, they're lighter. They're easier to pack if I'm expecting a lot of wind, I may throw in the little tiny windscreen that TOAKS offers as well. That's like I don't even know if it breaks one ounce of additional weight and that's only if I for some reason knew it was gonna be a problem. So that's where I sit with it is the weight-to-performance.
[00:07:38] Brigham: Doesn't pay off. Yeah, I'd say I'm 100% aligned there. Totally agree. I would say the The gain in. Boiling time or heat. To gas and fuel efficiency. Is not proportionate to the gain in weight, in my, in my experience and opinion. So if I really, you know, need to Get that much heat efficiency. I'm going to a completely different stove system and that's like a very, very rare set of conditions. High altitude extreme cold to make those kind of gains worth it because the other things a factor in is it's a bulkier system that that heat-exchanger pot. It's not only twice as heavy, it's significantly bulkier and yeah I don't find the I'd say.
[00:08:35] Brigham: I would call it an insignificant gain in efficiency worth the more significant gain in weight. Yeah, so,
[00:08:44] Tayson: Speaking in like massive generalities, I would say you gain like 25 to 50% efficiency on the high end. But you're you're you're adding like more than double typically the stove weight and so that just doesn't isn't paying off. I guess in terms of what I see, To build on this. So there's another question that came in from Josh anderle. And Josh was asking with all of the various fire regulations. What cook systems are you normally using? How does that play into your membership offerings? So, start off with this kind of second part of this inside of our membership. If there's in view that aren't familiar with a membership, we retail proven essentials essentially. So we
[00:09:29] Tayson: retail some titanium cook systems, alcohol stoves. We, we sell like the Optimus Crux Lite stove. And so, we have a few things that we like, and we sell inside there and, and obviously, with the membership, you save 10% and you get rebates back on those. So it's a really good deal for buying some of these kinds of things, but we do offer both options, I guess, and I say both, there's, there's more options out there. Like, Brigham just referred to maybe like, like a white gas stove up or something, we don't have those, but
[00:09:59] Tayson: Really, those are kind of your two canister-style stove or alcohol-style stove. And you are right there, are certain areas where an alcohol stove is, is not okay. It's not not kosher to use due to fire regulations. It's considered an open fire in a say, fire-restricted area. So that is something to note. Where I sit with this and I'm different than pretty much every single other person on my team. I like alcohol stoves. I'm packed up to go for this trip tomorrow. It's gonna be a two nighter and basically all of three days on trail and I'm using an alcohol stove. So I just I prefer it if I can, it's not until I
[00:10:42] Tayson: get into like five to seven day trips that I switched to a gas stove and that's because of efficiency starts to balance out at that point in terms of total weight, when you're factoring and weight of the stove, excuse me, the gas specifically compared to the stove set up. Wait it's lighter for my alcohol system than it is for just the Crux Lite, stove itself. So because of that when I get into longer trips I’ll switch to a gas canister stove or colder temperatures like, Brigham just mentioned alcohol. Can be a bit more challenging to ignite and to get up to boil and working really well in colder temperatures. Gas stoves can typically work
[00:11:22] Tayson: Little bit better there. Or for some reason, I think I'm going to be camping even remotely close to my excuse me, cooking, remotely close to my tent. I don't advise this but occasionally I might cook in your vestibule and I don't like to do that with an alcohol stove either. So those are some some of my preferences on that and I use both I just do. I think it's there's they're not terribly expensive to have both. If you could only have one, I think that's why most people end up just getting a gas canister. So I think in general for more purposes more use case, scenarios gas canisters are still going to be a little
[00:11:57] Tayson: bit more bulletproof and a little bit easier to use. So yeah, I would say, you know, if
[00:12:04] Brigham: you're really wanting to get Super nitpicky about this over that. There's really no other way to figure out what works for you other than get them and try them.
[00:12:17] Brigham: I never use an alcohol stove because I got one and tried it and was not happy with it at all. In very warm, mild conditions. So I stick, you know, for whatever advantages there may be Weight Wise. I don't find them significant enough for me to just change from Just what works. And what's just more consistent around the board across the board for me. So I just use 550 mL TOAKS pot unless I'm not solo. So I'll use a 550 mL TOAKS pot for pretty much all my solo trips, which is 80% of what I do. And then I use a separate stove but it's not one that we carry in membership, but I find it to
[00:13:01] Brigham: be quite a bit better, but it's a Soto WindMaster. It's quite a bit pricier, but it's for that type of stove. It's the best one I've found. And it's for me, it's just kind of meeting a right in the middle really well balanced. It's just very consistent always going to work and that, you know, that stoves under three ounces of the pot is under three ounces. And um, but yeah, I mean because at the end of the day, it's It's there's a lot of personal preference to come comes in to play there because you know, like on a five-day Uinta Highline Trail trip. My back was really, really light. And that's the system I
[00:13:43] Brigham: had and I never, you know, fell at any kind of disadvantage and do we probably using the alcohol stove. So on that trip as well, were you Probably five days. Yeah you know and you didn't feel like you were missing or anything either. So I'll
[00:14:00] Tayson: say this like it it just does take me two to three minutes longer to cook my food. For three minutes. Like so that, that's my payoff. I love the quietness of the alcohol stove. Very whisper quiet. I mean the Soto’s quiet. I really hate. Jetboil or MSR Pocket Rocket. Yeah, yeah. I'm like an a very loud. They're so loud. I hate that they're fast. They're fast though, but I'm sorry. But I know that I'm gonna be two three minutes behind the rest of the team in. Getting my food, cooked, that doesn't usually bother me. Because if we're stopping for significant enough amount of time to cook, I can usually just prioritize getting my water started
[00:14:41] Tayson: faster than other people or something. And it's, it's in negligible factor for me. But But yeah, I mean, I would agree. And I mean, while we're on the topic right now, we only carry one, gas-canister-style stove. That's something we could. We could definitely expand upon. So if there's once you guys want to take a look at her or look at so, offering in the membership, Leave us a comment and we can always look at that. I've used the Crux Lite quite a bit. It's um I've been pretty happy with it but I know that there's there's lots of options out there and and we could probably find a slightly lighter one or, you
[00:15:15] Tayson: know, more rugged one. There's all sorts of different directions to go from there but I think that I think that answers it again, fire regulations, you're going to want to stick with the get the gas-canister-style stove.
Editor’s note: Stove models, membership inventory and benefits, efficiency estimates, and company assortment plans are March 2025 context and personal experience. Follow current land-manager fire restrictions and manufacturer instructions; never cook in a tent, and treat vestibule use as a serious fire and carbon-monoxide hazard.
[00:15:28] Tayson: Jason White asked at what point before your hike. Do you slow or stop your gym or weight training or just training in general? For a long weekend trip. Let's say it's 50 miles. How long would you? You know, stopped working out before then. And then let's say it's a week-long trip of 100 miles.
[00:15:50] Brigham: that's, Really tough one is its talk. I maybe I would just say what I do. You say what you do? Yeah. Because
[00:15:58] Brigham: We're gonna be different and you're gonna be different and where everyone is at in there. current fitness or training, or health levels is gonna be different. All right. I'll just use the 50 mile. the 50 Mi weekend hike for example, like I wouldn't I would not change anything about. My 365 day a year routine. Like I wouldn't I wouldn't have any problem if the days just lined up the day before, was a running day or hiking day or gym day and then the next day going and doing that hike like that wouldn't I wouldn't change anything from that. If I was gonna do like a hundred, my hike like when we're doing the back-to-back Grand
[00:16:45] Brigham: Canyon, I would probably give myself. Two to three days of of just kind of rest and and not working out. but yeah, that's that's probably how I thought, you know, like, last year I did, I after work one day, I drove down to the Grand Canyon and did a rim to rim to rim and it wasn't You know the difficulty for me was just sleep deprivation at that point. I think I had either ran or hiked or went to the gym the day before. Um, but yeah. That distance especially if you're doing it all in one push, it's like sleep and calories is more. What's going to gonna gonna hit you more than like, whether or
[00:17:34] Brigham: not you you rested for
[00:17:36] Tayson: two days or three days. Yeah, this one is I want to answer it and I could answer it for 20 to 30 minutes. I feel like because it's it's very unique and independent to to where you're at and and that even changes from for me. Um, depending on what time of year how much I'm training, what kind of training I'm doing? So, for example, I really hate when I say done like a heavy, like, if I'm at the gym and I'm lifting doing legs, I hate getting to a trailhead and actually feeling. I still got fatigue or soreness in my legs. So I'll be very conscious of that. If I, if I'm running, you know,
[00:18:11] Tayson: I don't necessarily want to get to a trail and just feel that soreness in my legs either for that. So what I end up doing is, let's say it was the 50-mile example? I'm probably not gonna hit my legs, very hard for two days, prior maybe all jog, you know, a little bit, run around a little bit, but I'm probably not gonna, like lift legs at the gym or if I am, it's gonna be like one or two lighter sets. And that way that keeps me showing up the trailhead feeling pretty fresh. If I'm doing 100-miler I might extend that if it's special, if it's still hike, not like an
[00:18:48] Tayson: ultra marathon, I might extend that like one more day or something and the primary reason behind that is a lot of the 100 miles that I've done so far have been at altitude and showing up to a trail. You want your body to be really rejuvenated showing up at altitudes to put yourself in the best position to reduce the risk of altitude sickness. And that means getting sleep, like, good sleep, two days prior, and if your body's in recovery mode, from excessive like workouts and stuff like that, that doesn't help you show up to that trail, really recover, really, fresh really, you know, having slept well, It's all like this cumulative fatigue factor. So yeah for me you know
[00:19:28] Tayson: for specifically on the leg side I'm giving myself two, three days prior for hikes, not working too hard on the legs and then, but with that, sometimes I will say continue to lift the upper body a little bit harder. Because, yes, I do use my trekking poles pretty aggressive. I feel like and pull on them pretty hard when I'm climbing up hills and stuff, but I don't really feel the massive fatigue that I would feel if I was to show up at a trail with having run five or 10 miles the day before or having done some kind of a, you know, whatever walking. Or something like that with kettlebells like that would, that would be
[00:20:03] Tayson: felt so much more. So, But it is, it is very specific and I will I will say that that changes depending on where I'm at my training for the year as well. This year I'm kind of behind versus like last year and so it would my answer could have varied a little bit from last year to this year. So very specific experience is always the best teacher for you individually. So Moving on here,
Editor’s note: These training, rest, soreness, sleep, calorie, and altitude comments are personal March 2025 routines, not medical or individualized training advice. Adjust for your health and experience, and seek qualified guidance for injury, illness, or altitude-risk concerns.
[00:20:25] Tayson: Don Glazier, thoughts about adding a very simple shoulder strap to the larger dry bags. So it could double as a Day hike bag as well as a clothes bag, and he plans to design, or sell backpacking gloves that are warm, but lightweight. So starting with the kind of adding straps to a dry bag, I'll let you go after this
[00:20:48] Brigham: one first and then I'll, I'll hit it. Yeah, I mean we don't have any plans to do that. My answer that would be, you know the answer to why? Why not. I want a dry bag to be really good at being a dry bag. And I want a daypack to be really good at being a daypack. So if I put straps on a dry bag that I'm regularly using for my top quilt or sleeping bag, just some little straps, make that dry bag, not as good as the dry bag, they get in the way. Just become one more thing to get caught, snagged, fail, or tear. So I'd be, you know, why not, you know,
[00:21:29] Brigham: Not going to argue whether or not you know because it's just a kind of personal opinion at that point that would be handy or not. Yeah, that might be handy. I just have a hard time finding the a real legitimate consistent use case, where I'm gonna Feel like I need to take the dry bag that my top quilt or sleeping bag was in and then go for a Day hike.
[00:21:54] Tayson: So, I think also, there are some dry bags out there. The kind of do this. Well, they have to also increase the durability of the dry bag, right? So because it's now an exterior product versus an interior product in your backpack. So you're gonna have to add more and more weight to your dry bag plus the straps. And so it starts to become a different animal of what it is. I personally like for what you're saying too. I I run our Drifter 16-liter pack super light, super compressible. It's not a dry bag but it's it kind of has worked like that for me. Well, I'll pack it and I'll literally use it inside of another
[00:22:34] Tayson: pack as an organizational pack. Then when I get where I’m going, I can just unload it, put whatever I want it and use it as a as a day pack then, and then you have actual shoulder straps. You have a sternum strap, you've got water bottle Pockets, you got some more organization and that piece weighs, it's a really, really light as well. I mean, it's almost like they're dry bags, but it’s ounces, not pounds, you know, so I prefer kind of that thing that as well. So Yeah, I think I think the rest of what he said is spot on. You start you start adding a bunch of different aspects and and it becomes
[00:23:07] Tayson: not good at the certain thing you wanted to be good at and or you start adding weight and and so on and so forth. So I don't think that we're interested in doing that at this time, but I would encourage you to just if you're looking for a product that works that way, obviously The Drifter works really well. Like I say I'll pack I can pack that I usually don't do this, if I'm backpacking, because I do use my backpack. But let's say I'm traveling. I'll pack that like an organizational packing Cube. And then when I get where I'm going, I have this little day pack. That's really handy. I use that a lot for
[00:23:39] Tayson: carry on on, I'm traveling. So I'll get to when I'm getting on an airplane. I'll actually pull out my Drifter backpack that has like, My book and my headphones or something like that, I want to have on the airplane, I'll set that at my seat and then I'll put my KotaUL, you know on the overhead. Yeah items. So you kind of use them in conjunction like that.
[00:23:58] Tayson: The second part of this question was any plans to design or sell backpacking gloves? that are warm but lightweight. Anything's on the table. Yeah. If I mean, it's a part of our kit, it's part of a layering system. There's, there's reason for us to, to look at that. We've also obviously used gloves extensively and we're always getting ideas. We're always, buying, new gloves, testing new concepts. We have some great Concepts, but we have a lot of things to design. So it's always like, when will we get there? We went. And when we get there, we want to make sure that we have enough resources to do them well to do them right. So the in short, I
[00:24:36] Tayson: would say, Yeah, someday you'll probably see us making gloves timeline on that. I probably won't give you any kind of a time line.
[00:24:45] Brigham: Yeah. Definitely nothing determined timeline-wise at this point, but
[00:24:48] Tayson: yeah, something were we're looking at. But as much as you guys are excited about us designing things. So we but it's the from this side of the table, we're balancing a lot of different projects, right? So Terry Canedo,
[00:25:05] Tayson: why hasn't someone put a strip of Mylar or whatever? Reflective material is in sleeping pads into a pillow? Wouldn't it make the pillow warmer for those of us who used top quilts on the ground? And a hammock or sleeping bag, the pillow remains insulated. So it's basically just saying, why not, add insulation to a pillow. You know, if we're adding it to sleeping pads, why aren't we adding it to pillows? It's a good question. I think, first and foremost, you're putting your pillow on top of an insulated pad typically. So it's not directly on the ground. It gives you a little bit of a barrier keeps it a little bit warmer. Second would probably be weight
[00:25:44] Tayson: is a small factor. Obviously mylar doesn't weigh much, so that's not as big of a factor. I only personally noticed that my pillow is, you know, quote unquote cold, when I'm getting into really cold situations. Say sub, 20 degree Fahrenheit. You know, so you're well below freezing temperatures at that point. And I for what I have seen around, seems like most people have have typically add like an insulating layer on the outside of the pillow. But it's a good question. I mean, I I don't think it should be ever ruled out as an option and I don't, but I don't know if anyone. Yeah
[00:26:23] Brigham: I don't know of anyone. You know specifically using just a strip of Mylar or mylar in general. I mean, for it to really be effective. You need multiple layers of it and they need to be Like it couldn't just be. Mylar just pressed up against the inside of the of the fabric, if anybody's used what we, you know, the traditional, what we call a space blanket. Like, you're not gonna get warm by wrapping up in a space blanket, right? That's mylar, it's reflective, right? So, same concept there, if it's just a single layer of mylar, I think it would be very ineffective, but I think. Just like mylar is used in some very warm sleeping pads. Like
[00:27:08] Brigham: they're probably a way to do it that would add, you know, basically kind of like an R-value to a to a pillow. So I think, in theory like there is a way to you know, make it so it Adds a lot of. Insulative value. But I don't think it would just be like, a single strip.
[00:27:28] Tayson: Yeah. I'm kind of thinking through that as well with sleeping pads. There's a lot construction wise to kind of thing through. I could see how this could like triple the cost of the pillow.
[00:27:39] Brigham: It really turn into $100 pillow. Pretty easy.
[00:27:43] Tayson: Yeah. Yeah. Because it's adding a bunch of stuff to the manufacturing process and that's where a good amount of the cost comes in. And so I could also see how maybe no one has done it yet because they're like, oh, I don't know if we can sell an $85 pillow, you know, like So that may be a factor that, you know, again from kind of sitting at the design side, maybe, maybe something. But yeah it's not it's not the worst idea. But so far, most people are adding insulation to the exterior of pillows. We'll see, we'll see if that changes over the next couple of years. I don't know. That'll be something we work
[00:28:22] Tayson: on though. Next question, here from Jessica Nash. She's got four questions here and I'm probably gonna read the first couple and we can answer them all as a group.
Editor’s note: Dry-bag, Drifter, glove, insulated-pillow, cost, and future-product comments reflect March 2025 products and company thinking, not current specifications, availability, pricing, or commitments.
[00:28:35] Tayson: I actually lost one's really easy. I heard Tayson say he was a boy in Boy Scouts as wondering if he made Eagle.
[00:28:42] Tayson: Yes, I am an Eagle Scout.
[00:28:44] Brigham: Me too. I made Eagle.
[00:28:45] Tayson: Sick. Oh, are you?
[00:28:46] Brigham: I did, yeah.
[00:28:47] Tayson: Yes, we have two Eagle Scouts on camera here.
[00:28:49] Brigham: This room was soaring with eagles.
[00:28:54] Tayson: Other questions though,
[00:28:55] Tayson: I was curious, if you have any women doing the product testing, like, you do on the men's side for that line of products. Will you be extending women's apparel in the future? Will you be adding a children's line of gear and apparel. So starting, I guess with the women's side, I'll let you. we do
[00:29:17] Brigham: have women test our products sometimes, and I would say it's pretty proportionate to the number of, The is proportionate to the ratio of men’s-specific and women’s-specific products that we offer. And which is also a pretty similar to kind of like the amount of men's versus women's product that we actually sell. So yeah, we do have women test our products but you know to be very transparent, it's It's not as many as we have men testing our product because most of our product line is men's specific. and then, For expanding, are we expanding? We hope to. Continue to expand women's again, it has to be done for us. It has to be done in
[00:30:14] Brigham: the sensible, sustainable way. Like, I would say, don't expect us to make a giant step in number of women's offerings. In a short period of time. It's going to be just a gradual continual process of Adding more and more women’s-specific designs and styles just over time. And we definitely We'd love to see the demand increase, because we will respond. Proportionately, you know.
[00:30:50] Tayson: Yeah, and we have seen women, it has grown, you know, like it's it's grown but it's still a fraction of business compared to the men’s side, but we are continuing to invest or continuing to invest more into women's. In fact, I've been looking at some of the ordering we've been doing right now and we're putting a little bit more. I mean, we're trying to get a little bit more aggressive with it all the time but it's it's in increments for sure. So Hopefully, hopefully over more like years than months. You'll continue to see that side of things grow and expand. As far as kids’ line of gear, that's even farther out than women. Even as both
[00:31:35] Tayson: me and Brigham have have kids. It's still just doesn't make a ton of sense and there's there's maybe other ways to get gear items that when your kids are growing really fast or to be honest. Kids need more like really durable products compared to the line of products that we typically make and Things of that nature. Doesn't make a ton of sense. I guess for us so far. And so we haven't and it's not necessarily on the near Horizon. I will say this though, I bought a some of the Women's small stuff and put my kids in it and
[00:32:12] Brigham: it fit fairly well. Right? I know women’s small, or the extra-small like, in a t-shirt I was like holy cow. This fits my, like, six-year-old.
[00:32:21] Tayson: You're very excited the other day because my my
[00:32:24] Brigham: oldest I threw a size small. like a Ventus or a Vario and and I thought, actually like you can take that backpacking. Now because it's it's enough to be able to be usable and just not be a giant bag on her, you know? Yeah, I'm very excited about that. Yeah.
Editor’s note: Women’s product testing, apparel expansion, sizing examples, and children’s-gear plans describe March 2025 status and personal fit observations, not current availability, specifications, fit guarantees, or launch commitments.
[00:32:45] Tayson: All right. So that's an option, you know, obviously, but no, no plans for for additional kids’ gear. So, Okay, we have more questions to cover on another day. We'll have to hold these. We've had our 30 minutes just wanted to, I mean, just kind of maybe even recapping to the customer's question. Jason's question about the training and you know, when do you cut off training and things like that? I kind of heard tells into the 100 Mile Challenge, which we still have registrations open for.
[00:33:15] Tayson: We have already exceeded previous-year signups, it's doing extremely well. We get a ton of repeat people jumping into 100 Mile Challenge. If you've never heard 100 Mile Challenge, it is a I don't know the best way to explain this but it's it's a course where we essentially sign up for it. Set a big goal to hike either 100-mile trail or to do 100 miles worth of hiking and a couple month period and then we go through everything from setting goals planning training you know diet nutrition. We go through lightening your gear, your gear contingency plans, all these kinds of things in a course style system with videos and workbooks we also are going
[00:33:59] Tayson: to have multiple live sessions where you can come on and ask us questions throughout the course and a whole bunch of other stuff that that's included in there. It's a really cool Community. The community aspect is maybe the coolest part of all of it, we get a bunch of people that join our Facebook closed group for the year and they just pump pump up each other and share a bunch of wins in there. And it's just a, really really positive Community this year. If you sign up, you'll actually get a free Merino wool Tern Hoodie, it's an $85 hoodie and to sign up, is only $67. So, again, I said this Before actually just
[00:34:36] Tayson: break. Even if we're lucky on this program, we're trying not to lose money. And but because we're so passionate about connecting people to the outdoors, getting him out there on trips like this. It's worth it for us. So we love to do this program, signups are still going on. We have all been running some sales on the website, so if you're not on our email list to get on our email list, Fact the Fastpack sale going on right now. And it's it's kicking but it's doing really, really well. And has me nervous about some inventory issues later in the year. So, if you want some things like the Fastpack or the Shadowlight, make
[00:35:09] Tayson: sure to jump on those because these sales that we did in March here have done a number on some of the inventory there, but make sure you're on our email list. Make sure you subscribe to the podcast and I'm missing anything. Brigham.
Editor’s note: OV 100 registration, inclusions, pricing, community access, March sales, and Fastpack or pack inventory comments describe a March 2025 offer and status, not a current promotion, price, availability guarantee, or commitment.
[00:35:21] Brigham: We appreciate the questions. Yeah I would encourage you to keep keep sending them in and yeah we hope to keep this pumping out you know, helpful valuable. Information for you guys.
[00:35:32] Tayson: Yeah, absolutely keep sending them in and we'll see you guys on a future episode.
