EP 15 - OV Wind River Team Trip

Tayson: Here's the big question, how do we live a life? Full Adventures, travel and memories on our terms without being millionaires without previous experience? And without unlimited amounts of time, that's the big question and this podcast will give you the answers. I'm your co-host Tayson

Brigham: and I'm Dave and you're listening to the live ultralight podcast powered by Outdoor Vitals.

Tayson: Hey, what's up obviously tribe. Welcome to the live ultralight podcast. Today on the episode, we're going to be talking about our company trip, annual trip or bigger trip of the Year. This year, we did Wind Rivers. And so, we went there spent three nights and had a good time and so on the podcast, I have a bunch of people, let go ahead and spat out your name. Several knows who's in the room with us, Derek, Dave, Brigham and Darren. So this is, this is the Arsenal. We got marketing, we got support help, we got product design, just just everyone in the room. This is everyone that came with us on the trip. We have one more that wasn't able to be in here today. And we may talk about him a little bit through this podcast, all good things though. Anyway, so the Wind Rivers trip. This year, that's what we chose. We look once a year at doing a big trip as a company and kind of the parameter I set is we want to be within eight hours driving distance of the office. And that's pretty much about what we were to go to the Wind Rivers. And I kind of let Dave head up a lot of the planning for this and the planning turned out to be pretty important. As we ended up calling an audible on the route itself and typically I probably would never plan for an audible. And in this case, it worked out, super, super effectively, we, we had one member of the team that wasn't feeling up for a massive hike, just due to some health concerns and kind of how they're feeling with that and then two we got snow. So this is early September. And as we're driving up there, we knew that there was potential for snow. And Saul of us, I think all of us kind of grabbed one temperature, rating of Colder sleeping bag, then was probably in our bag to begin with. And as we got to the trailhead, we drove right in to the snow. So anyone surprised by that or we all expecting that?

Brigham: yeah, I mean I wasn't really surprised I just wasn't 100% sure when we were looking at the weather and we're trying to find like different locations and on the internet, like where exactly we should look for the weather, what town, or what mountain range, and things like that. So that would be the only thing that I think was a little bit difficult and trying to figure out which way we want to go. And then try and find the weather for that. Killer exact location?

Tayson: Yeah. There's, there's some pretty good apps and we're using all trails and, and some weather stations and things where we're able to get some decent feedback going into it. I think the biggest thing was There's a lot to be said about planning and we'll talk a lot about the planning, but there's also something to be said about watching it like, right before you leave, because that storm seemed to come in, you know, right? As we were about to leave. And thankfully, we were watching it pretty close and and I know I changed up some gear, you know, the day before we left. Probably, so as you keep going through this, I kind of want to know that we're gonna try to kind of talk our way through this trip, but also dissect it and pull out just as much valuable Snippets, as we can, for bringing you. They're looking at doing a similar hike, is this or just backpacking in general? So as we go along, we'll probably lots of interruptions as we do this, but Hopefully, it's all valuable stuff. So Whether so we walked in, we start hiking in and everything is this really really wet snow. I took us longer to hike in for sure because of this really wet snow and when we got to Camp, I mean everything, everything was wet. A lot of times in ultralight backpacking. People are kind of doing floorless shelters and all sorts of things like that. I think all of us were pretty happy to have, floored shelters in this scenario. And I would say my big takeaway for that night, something that I already practiced, but I think can be easily overlooked especially by people that have thrown up in the outdoors. It's very easy to get headstrong that you can start a fire. And just go. Yeah. I've always been able to start a fire. Just need a lighter. I don't need any kind of extra additives. I can always find dry stuff. Like I can always find the right wood and this that and the other and because it wasn't rain and it wasn't just snow. It was like this combo effect of just this really, really wet snow. Everything was really, really wet stuff under the trees was wet. Just ever looked the wood was wet and all of us kind of wanted to Fire and thankfully we have some fire starters in Camp. I believe we actually used one of Darren's but That that was pretty pivotal in us being able to get that really, really wet wood started up. Um, any thoughts on that house on that that first camp where we were at what we're doing?

Brigham: I was impressed with Darren. You guys getting that? I really did. And I think I'm walking in. I was like, there's no way we're gonna get a fire, like, how wet it was. I mean, and it did, I mean, it was nice to have a fire too. That was a nice little treat.

Tayson: Yeah, I think we all kind of sat down I think we dried out a little bit of stuff that might have gotten wet. But, but mainly, you know, we got to sit and hang out instead of just all Retreat to our tents and get in our bags, super early because man, you know, it makes for a long night. And and whatnot, we were camped by late and so we had moisture, you know, that cold from the lake as well as the snow but believe it or not, this was the warmest night of the truth, right? Try to do a little fishing that night and I think we all got skunked. I remember, right? Might not have done a whole lot of fishing though. Yeah there's a whole lot of that night but we returned to this campsite later. But yeah any other thoughts I guess from from that first day hiking in

Brigham: I mean, I was just say, The actual hiking with the amount of moisture we had was was difficult because all the trails were basically washed out in there, a little stream. So I was a lot of I don't know, back and forth, back and forth. Not really hiking on a straight line, so that makes it a little bit more. Difficult, I would say. And I also think that first day, that was probably the worst, the weather was right.

Tayson: Yeah.

Brigham: That I mean just the first five two hours is the worst weather wise but Part of the adventure. Yeah,

Tayson: I don't know. It was I could see how sometimes even myself. I don't like particularly enjoy hiking in like foul weather or inclement weather. But man it was worth it like

Brigham: yeah. Because

Tayson: it was it was ugly when we started. It was wet heavy, snow. But like, oh, halfway three quarters into the hike. The clouds broke and like the blue sky came out and it was just like a winter wonderland and It's just so worthy, you know. I just I remember feeling like, man, this is so worth. It's just getting out, even though it was snowing and just hiking because it was awesome, what's that? Saw the least people that day too. Yeah you feel like you're on the trail more alone.

Brigham: I think the contrast of the trees still being alive and leaves being on them. And the green with the white snow is something that I don't really see very often so I was a cool little treat to have snow so early in the season where everything's still alive, but you still get the white background.

Tayson: Yeah I I think the first day was my favorite day of the whole trip just because of that. I also like I like the sun on the on the fresh fallen snow but I also really liked the fog and all the cloud cover. I think it just gave a new dimension, a new look. It's all the surroundings that you don't really see most of the time when you're hiking in any kind of clear weather and I just thought that looked kind of a little bit more mysterious a little bit, just A New Perspective and I thought that was just the funnest. The funnest thing to be hiking and for me.

Brigham: And I don't know if you want to touch on this later now but I know balls was one thing that we were really weird about and I think we looked out

Tayson: with he had me. Taking garlic pills. Yeah. I was like, taking garlic pills leading up to it and we checked the wedding like two days before him like. Yeah.

Brigham: So that looked out with not having to bring his money.

Tayson: We did for sure. Think all shiny cigar mosquito netting out of our packs and our bug sprays, we took out. Yeah. I've been to the wood Rivers before and different part of the season is middle of the summer, but At that time we were we were breathing mosquitoes. So that was awesome. That there weren't really any this time. Yeah, two things I did want to touch on, this is a kind of talk about how wet that snow was because of that snow. It kind of remained wet the next few days but specifically that day I was I was thankful for for two things. I mean, I had a, I had a rain later, a waterproof layer, I mean, I was thankful for that but I I used to trash compactor bag inside of my backpack. and just there's Peace of Mind, knowing that what needs to be dry dry and that worked out really well for me on the trip and I was extremely careful on that first day to keep my feet as dry as possible because I have gotten my Gore-Tex boots. Wet in the past and there's just no drying those things out. They just once a gortex boot fails or gets wet on the inside. You're pretty much done for the trip takes. It takes a lot, a lot, a lot, a lot to try them out. So just one thing that I definitely was very conscious of walking in was trying to make sure I wasn't stepping in any puddles or anything like that. Obviously, I was walking in snow, but just trying to walk on the top of the snow on the high points of the snow because sometimes you'd even step in a spot that she thought was snow and it, The layer of water underneath it, but yeah, that I think pay dividends, we had a Ethan who wasn't here his feet. You know, we're wet probably most of the days of the trip and it definitely were on him. And Dave, did your feet, get wet that day? Or was it the next?

Brigham: And they're probably halfway through, they got wet and then I was just Whatever. At that point, I could care less. I was trudging through all the puddles and stuff, but even with the fire, like I could not get a bootstrap

Tayson: and

Brigham: there they are gorax. But I think for me after, you know, The next day just used to your feet getting wet. Like it's just trying to keep her socks drive would be the best piece of advice. I guess at that point just fresh socks every day.

Tayson: Yeah I mean that's the number one reason that I got Frostbite on my feet once and it was because my boots got wet. I was unable to dry them out like I thought I could and even switching the socks. I mean it's not going to dry out your boots and so that that has bitten me in the butt before. So I'm always just very conscious and very conscious where I'm putting my feet down because

Brigham: yeah,

Tayson: it really sucks to have wet boots for the rest of the trip.

Brigham: I mean thankfully for me my feet were never really cold, they were just wet so they're just a little uncomfortable but Frostbite or anything, wasn't really an issue, and I did bring Camp shoes so that really helped a lot to be able to sit around camp or whatnot with a drive, something Dry On My Feet.

Tayson: So, mainly, I mean, you and Ethan, the biggest things were just the extra friction and things that are caused. By that moisture in your boots. You're going to blister more easily and things like that. So, okay. Well, that was night one. We slept that night in our warmest temperatures yet which seems crazy because I mean there's snow everywhere and whatnot and worse. Still early December. I mean September. Sorry. So the next morning we got up, we packed up camp, and we started to head up higher towards tick on Basin. We walked past a few of the major lakes their bumped into a few more people. I really like this day it was it was fairly kicked back and then we got in to take home Basin at a good time. And got to spend a few hours before night trying to fish and just taking in the beauty of that basin. Yeah, we struck out pretty hard on the fishing up until that point. We had not caught a fish and we were all excited about. Well, the more.

Brigham: Yeah, we caught we caught fish that morning at that Lake weekend.

Tayson: Yeah, like good,

Brigham: five inch size, this year. Solid five inches right there. I don't like that.

Tayson: Like, I don't think there was at this point in the year. I think they moved on and I actually on this trip was trying a new fly rod. I'm going to space the model, think Kara fly rod. So I was all amped up to fish and give this a shot. I'd never fly fished and Yeah, just struck out really hard and finally I think towards the end of the night, I just put the pole away and started enjoying being there and really really pretty. Um, I don't know, lessons learned throughout that day, I think we pulled out our gear and tried to let it dry off during lunch time. And that was, that was really helpful. Just for me, like I had a single wall shelter that I was kind of testing out and pulled that out during lunch time and dried right out and was ready to go the next day. We were, I mean, I initially and had planned on bringing a hammock. and, You know, I really got on Google Earth and started looking at things closer and thankfully switched to a ground system, I would have been really so well into home base and there's there's just no trees up there. Barely found enough you know wood for a fire or anything like that. And then that night, you're up in the Basin, just snowed the day before. So it's wasn't warm during the day. You go up in the basement and there's literally glaciers surrounding you and there's this, there's a little bit of a breeze that night and that night definitely became our coldest. We were not far from single digit temperatures. And so yeah, it was, it was a cool night. I think that

Brigham: was not, that was pretty sure, it was a full moon that night and that wasn't a cloud in the sky. I remember again up to go the bathroom in the middle of the night and the moon, just bouncing off the water and the mountains and the background, that was One of the probably, like, most beautiful things I've ever seen to be with you, like, with the, the moon, and the water, and the stars, and things like that. I was two, three o'clock in the morning and I was like, man, it's freezing out, but I wish I could just sit here the rest of the night and take this all. And that was, that was really, really

Tayson: nice. That's so pretty man. Well, because like that that bass is all the rock is granted so it's a light colored granite. Snow all over the place, and a full moon clear skies? And it was just like, and it's this basic. So it's like, you're standing in like a light bulb. It was just, it was cool, man.

Brigham: Yeah, I would totally beautiful and if anybody's gonna go, like, try and go. On a full moon. I was

Tayson: yeah. Any, I definitely agree with all that. Some of the photos that we took up there were just really, really cool. Yeah, that's some cool photos of the tents and stuff up there. It's just just,

Brigham: I know we're on the fence up camping there, not, but I think it was totally worth it even though it's cold and there's no trees or anything like that. It was worth it.

Tayson: We didn't we had a fire not many of us hung around the fire too long at night. Oh by that fire. As long as I could it was because of that breeze. it was just steady Breeze, all night, and it was enjoyable being out there with the moon and hanging out by the like we had the fire built in between some big rocks. So there was a lot of like reflecting going on and keeping everybody like huddled up to it. I think enjoyed it.

Brigham: If anybody's interested, they could probably go to Randy's website and see those pictures.

Tayson: Yeah. Outdoor detour. So if you're gonna Instagram or is website, look up outdoor detour Andy or Randy? Sorry, joined us on the trip. And took some really cool photos up in there as well. What about, what about that night? So, I know for me personally, I was in a top quilt. I was trying to go as I can my, I think my base weight before I added my Garmin in reach and my fishing pole. My fishing poles like eight Oz, my garment in reaches like eight ounces. I think I was right at 10 pounds, so I was up at 11 pounds base weight and to do that. I had to switch to that top quilt for sure. That is 0 degree top quilt. And one thing I was pretty thankful for that night was just I took the other layers that I had and where I'm to bed, wrap them around my waist, if it was something, I didn't really want to wear just just to kind of help with that draft. One thing, I Sound is the colder, it gets the more that the draft when you move or roll or anything like that is going to affect you and so I did that and and slipped slept pretty well that night. But any other thoughts on their sleep systems where you warm or you're not. I also had a top quilt and I would agree. Definitely about the draft thing when it gets colder. I move around a lot when I sleep and so I felt it all night long. One thing I did help was I did the same thing. I had a jacket, one of our Loft Tech jackets and I wrapped that around me inside my top quilt and and that helped wherever that jacket was but he couldn't. Cover my entire body. So I still felt every time I moved a little bit of a draft so I found myself actually in that case. Wanting sleeping bag instead of of quilt. I think it's just a preference thing for me because I move around so much when I sleep. I find that if I'm gonna be in Winter conditions, I do like a sleeping bag because then there's the insulation, on all sides. My problem was with the top quilt because I move around roll around and then I had the top quilt come. Me or it wasn't on me or, you know, I just struggled with that all night long. And so that that was my night. Is this kind of struggling to keep that quilt on top of me and around me? Mm-hmm.

Brigham: Yeah. I mean, I just Summit zero like so full mummy bag and I was good. I was even hot at times, but for me, anything below freezing. I'm always gonna go with a full mommy bag and lost them in a hammock and then I would do a top quilt under quilt. I'll do that below freezing but if it's Gonna be off for something. I'm always gonna go with the full mommy back. Personally. but in the summer, Cold Allah.

Tayson: I think I would I would say I'll still take a top quilt into the 20s personally.

Brigham: Yeah I wanted a cold.

Tayson: I hit the teens. I'm I'm liking the the fully in case version or

Brigham: for me I mean I'll always bring a little extra weight and be comfortable. Like that's

Tayson: just my

Brigham: style.

Tayson: Cool, you know, piece of feedback on that night gear or anything there. So okay, so the next morning, we were amped up to catch some fish. At this point, we are we are amped up. So me and Darren, you know, we we roll out of the, the tents early. I dropped my tent, throw it in my bag. He's right behind me, there are some streams and stuff. That looked really good right below to come and then you kind of drop down more and it hits. There's a big lake down there and I don't know, we had some miscommunication I thought I was I thought Darren was coming to meet me and he never met up with me. And so after some hours of me fishing, this Inlet for it with no success, I finally, Went and found him and still still no one from up top. We're like man, we're these guys at today, you know. So we go fish with him and we fish for together. He practiced for another wild two hours. At least when we got together. Like yeah, you'd been fishing, I've been fishing. We still hadn't caught anything. We're we're we'll start crazy. Finally was it. Randy, Randy came down, you and Randy dropped down to a different Lake to try to look there. On her way to toward be that night. And I kid you not as you walked away, I caught the elusive golden trout, and was pretty stoked about that. So for those of you don't know, in the winter River range and I believe in the high Sierra's, there's a species of fish called the, the golden trout. That's Of the coveted thing to catch. And anyway, so it I'll be able to catch one of those and then I sat there I had lunch and whatever and finally these sleepyheads catch back up to us, I don't know. Feel Like, hours later. I don't know what they were doing up there, but

Brigham: I feel like, I don't know. I don't really sleep in but I'm more very I think. Brigham is too a very tidy person. So like I need to put everything in its Sack or wherever it needs to be rolled up the way I came out and so it takes me a little bit longer to get ready in the morning. I would say

Tayson: Yeah, I I was in a hurry. I wanted to get my stuff out in the sun for a little while I had I gotta give some time to dry off and then I just took my time, I

Brigham: was experiencing sickness to the night the day before. Like that's just I guess that's my mom now. So I was just taking

Tayson: it slow. I think the worst part of it though, is when you finally showed up, I was like, oh, he finally made it. Oh, by the way, we caught a bunch of fish on the way down from Camp. I was like,

Brigham: what? I've been fishing forever, you guys are sitting there. Pulling them out of the Stream. I want to get to know what he was

Tayson: note to self. If you've never fly fished, stay with the guy who has fly fishing for don't go on, off, on your own,

Brigham: he's trying to use trying to help me. I still traditional rod and reel. That

Tayson: is tough. Yeah. I mean I've been fly fishing for a while. So there was like this perfect 200 yard stretch of actual stream, you know, I have just had some good little pockets in there. Yeah, they were there. All right, I couldn't believe that

Brigham: a lot of people fishing like hiking in and out. I feel like, yeah, a lot of people have pulled

Tayson: that well in the thing was crazy. As we had to come Basin, basically to ourself, except for creepy guy. And the next day, man party. After party after party was, why I think

Brigham: it was Friday, right?

Tayson: There's the night is the night we slept in. So we were walking out of there on Friday and that's when we passed her to people's like everything

Brigham: looking to do that trying to do it during the week, if you can.

Tayson: Yeah, weekdays for sure. It's probably one of the biggest destinations in the Wind River range. So Um, so that point, anything else you need to update? I guess to that point before we drop down and off there. Oh, one thing I wanted to know It's an interesting thing. That day that we were hiking up to tick, home Basin. I had some really weird pain in my elbow. So my inflammation and I was like, what is going on with my elbow? I couldn't figure out if like something had poked me, if I hit it on, so it literally felt swollen like it, hit it on something and but there was I couldn't see anything. On the elbow. Just weird. I had this pain. I had this pain and didn't think a whole lot of it other than what, like, why? Like, I don't know why I've got this weird paint. I've never had pain in my elbow, and I'll come around to that, but So we can have lunch. We dropped down, we catch up with Darren and Randy at this Lake, and we were sure exactly where we were going to Camp that night. We were thinking of a few options. So they dropped at this Lake that we're thinking about camping and Darren. Darren is not as much of a Backpacker. I would say as the rest of us. He doesn't Just go do it every every chance he gets. So this this yearly trip is really healthy for him. But he was very he is an avid Fisher and he was very excited about catching fish. and so, as I Pull into this, this Lake. I look at Darren and he looks a little flustered. Maybe you could tell us what happened

Brigham: at this lake. So I may not be an avid Backpacker, but I am an avid Outdoorsman. So, I am out there all the time, and so when I go hiking, it's usually for a purpose, whether it's fishing, whether it's hunting, that's kind of my drive. It's not really for the views. It's more for the end goal.

Tayson: The Sportsman's,

Brigham: the Sportsman's aspect. And so, my whole goal on this whole trip was to catch fish. I've seen pictures for months of huge trout that people have been fat or fishing and catching. And that was my whole goal for this trip. So, like tasting that earlier, we had woke up at the butt crack of dawn. To go catch some fish. So we got, that was my whole goal for this whole trip. Well, me and Randy, you know, after we left taste and

Tayson: Randy all the stipulated in here, Randy had never caught a fish in his life. Never held a fishing license.

Brigham: Yeah, so

Tayson: it was a big deal. He was trying hard to catch a fish too.

Brigham: So me and Randy we go to this next Lake while we wait for everybody else and we start fishing and finally we start catching decent trout. You know not huge maybe half pound. Or know, like it's like, but still I was excited for it and, you know, Randy hadn't caught anything at this point. So I get him to come over to where I'm at, so he can start catching his first fish. and as I pull one up, you know, and I noticed that my worm hadn't come off my line and I was like, okay sweet, take the fish off, put it the cast back out, you know, I'm gonna take care of this fish. And keep fishing at the same time. As I do this, I just hear a flat. and, I got a big bite and I turn around just in time to watch my fishing pole. Go flying into the water. I'm fishing off of off of a cliff and I can't really do anything at this point Except watch my poll beeline deeper and deeper into that Abyss and so, My fishing trip got hot, just so I I was able to keep two fish for dinner that night, but it was disappointing that as soon as I got to some good area to fish. Like best part was too. We we got to sit there and look at

Tayson: your pole in the water. We could we found you could see it. The water was so clear.

Brigham: What was I? 20 feet deep?

Tayson: It was and it was out

Brigham: and it was and it was frigid water. Otherwise I would have went swimming for it but Since it just snowed it just smelled. It was gone. It was depressing but it was it was a memory worth remembering so

Tayson: yeah

Brigham: that was the story there

Tayson: it was it was quite humorous from the outside perspective but Darren Darren was maybe not all smiles if I remember, right? But the funny part two is Randy fish thought and could not catch a fish, he couldn't catch

Brigham: anything.

Tayson: You got back to back the pole, probably scared the rest away, but I think pull so that day we had down and we actually go back to our original camp and we started catching those five inches again. Yeah. Randy caught his very first trout. Five inch trout. He was pretty stoked. So that was his. His mission was complete. I think those that really wanted to catch a fish ended up catching

Brigham: I would say that was the best tasting fish though I've ever had in my life.

Tayson: I was just cooking in the fire with some tin foil. We brought up just with some

Brigham: sauce over. It was the best tasting trout I've ever had as good.

Tayson: Yeah, I I was not gonna, I was not looking forward to packing the fish, but since he did it for me, I appreciate it. So well,

Brigham: because I'm not saying,

Tayson: no, it really was, it was really, really good fish. Anytime you freeze meat, I think he loses taste out of it and so it's nice and you catch it and cook it, you know, right off like that. So we get we get down to the next camp and this is kind of where I wanted to Circle back. To Elbow thing. It was so cold. We kind of touched on earlier like we were using bugs spray. There's no bugs out anything like that. I set up my tent just threw everything in it walked out. Like I went we fished, we had dinner whatever and I walked back to my 10 for something and I think I sat in, on my pad and I looked up and I hadn't zip up my door. Just not And there's this big. Orange spider on the side of my tent. And I was just like, What the heck? There's no like, I wasn't thinking there's any bugs out there. And now I've got this orange bug crawling all over my tent. So I killed it. There's another one, another bright orange bug in my tent and another spot. So, Essentially. The circle and back here. I'm, I am sure that I got bit. By spider on that elbow, which caused the swell up? I've never had an issue with that elbow before. Never had one sense, but really, really surprised me. And they just that there was, there was bugs out there and I have found personally and you guys can can give You your input on this. I like being fully sealed in to attend now. That was one reminder. There's the time. I think I've talked on this on another podcast where I had, we there's those daddy long legs climbing all over us and signs Canyon and and I I've just I've done it enough now to know that I like to be fully zipped into the shelter. Well, that's a single wall, shelter, double wall, shelter, whatever it is and unless I'm off the ground if I'm gonna hammock. I don't, I'm not so worried. But man, if I am on the ground, I have now decided that I am going to zip in and even when I don't think there's bugs out, I'm probably still gonna sit in to it so feedback on that.

Brigham: I agree, completely. I was camping a few months ago and woke up. To the outside of my tent. Having Mormon crickets all over the outside and it was a terrifying sight. But I'd much rather them on the outside of the tent, then On my on my face, or just on me. So yeah, for sure. I definitely agree. Just being enclosed is as much better.

Tayson: Yeah.

Brigham: To me. I mean, it doesn't really bother me too much depending on on where I am. I'm pretty good just on the ground for the most part, but if I was there, and there's gonna be like mosquitoes and things like that, obviously, I went to sleep on the ground, but in the southwest here, for the most part, I'm good with just the pattern back on the ground.

Tayson: I'm with Dave, I just if I can get away with nothing more than a pad and sleeping bag, that's my very favorite way to Camp or sleep but like, you know, when there's a mosquitoes. Yeah.

Brigham: And I've never had that experience where, you know, like spiders are calling on my face and stuff. So I think if I did Me say that would be I don't know. I think I see Scorpion or something. Yeah,

Tayson: the other thing I'll add to is I constantly find spiders in my backpack, like that crawl in there, during the course of the night. I'm just like, if I find this many spiders in my backpack.

Brigham: Yeah.

Tayson: They're, they're not just in my backpack if I was on the ground. But I think you guys I mean, there's a, there's a something to say about how much you worry about it too. I think it's biology Professor or something told me once that like the average person eats three or four spiders, a year just in their own house while they're sleeping and crawls in their mouth because you know, there's spiders in your house and somewhere, warm and dark and I don't know how valid is but I can see it being someone true. So, I don't know. I think you're eating spiders anyway. If possibly, just don't worry about it, it is mental. Like, I agree, like it's mental and it's mindset. I have spent I would. Guess three to four hundred nights on the ground. with no mosquito or no netting whatsoever, just ground And a pad. In some pretty rugged, nasty country with nasty stuff, but it was because I was so exhausted that I was able to sleep. And I just didn't think about it because I cared about other things at the time. But like now, the That's more. I'm more recreationally spending that money nights on the ground? I think about it. Now now I'm like trying to have fun and enjoy it. and so I think about the tarantula that I saw while I was setting up my tent or like you know, the all the spiders, I don't know. Not a big fan of creepy crawlies but I would take the the bug protection if I could It's mental. Yeah, I've I've been on trips with Darren where I counted 20 inches and a half an hour walk. So, um, but I used to, I used to view that way a lot. And I just these experience as often up on me now to where I am, I'm committed to, if I need to sleep under a tarp or whatever. That's fine. I'll be bringing our hammock bug net. And that thing up around, and I will say to this too. I'm not too scared of the spiders in my house. I'm much more scared to the spiders that I don't know what they are and what their backgrounds are. And, you know, I don't do a full Security check on him before I sleep with them. Much less my living room last. Oh, I had rather take the ones. I don't

Brigham: care.

Tayson: Festival. Know right on so that that pretty much was getting close to the end of the trip. The next morning we packed up and headed out of there. So I wanted to take a few minutes, I guess to, to touch on some other takeaways from the trip. One takeaway that I had is is we did have a Garmin in reach. I personally carry one and it was nice because we were able to meet up with Outdoor detour. Randy and just kind of text him while we were already on the mountain and he found us no problems and just worked out. Well, I I have come to appreciate that. In fact, recently, on a trip I somehow in this cluster of different things. I went on a Day, hike, and left my phone in the truck, just because of It was its story for another day, but it was, it was Secure. It was I liked the fact that I had that garment in reach in my backpack so that if there wasn't an emergency, not at my phone and that's security that phone might bring, I had that way to call out. So I do appreciate those types of things. The other thing that was brought up before the jury before we started, this was was food. I really enjoyed the food. I had on this trip. I think Darren really enjoyed the food, he had on the trip and Also the food that he packed out and but Derek mentioned that, maybe he didn't get quite enough food. So let's let's just dive into the food conversation and and how you guys all fared. And if there's things you change, you know, it was the second day of the trip where I knew I could be a little bit of trouble lunchtime, we stopped for lunch and I pulled out my lunch and I eat it and I just want more after I can and things, I I start thinking and realized and you know what I think. I might not have enough food for this trip, at least to be comfortable. I had enough to live, no problem, but to be comfortable and full and satisfied, every meal, I don't think I did. My problem was playing, I didn't I didn't really pack at least not my food until the night before we left. There's a last minute kind of thing after work after you know taking care of a bunch of other responsibilities at home and just kind of was the last minute thought. Oh yeah. I better grab some food for the trip and throwing it all together. I've been on backpacking trips. Kind of just assumed I know it was doing and and, I think I just didn't plan well enough think through well enough each day like how much I would actually be wanting to eat or needing to eat to replenish the calories I was using and so So for me that was the biggest thing is is planning out the calories and how much I would really be wanting to eat each day because I did not do that. Yeah.

Brigham: Right. For me, I was the opposite. I actually Packed kind of last minute gear, for me, it's pretty easy to pack. I'm pretty organized at home and have everything where it needs to be and have stuff like that. So, here itself is easy for me, the food. I just brought too much, whereas, I didn't really think it out as much. I was in a hurry. So I just brought more than I needed. And Too much food, but

Tayson: acted out

Brigham: and packed it out. Yeah. So Derek told me he was hungry. I could have shared a little bit more with

Tayson: them. He gets that kind of quiet. I,

Brigham: yeah, I always I mean, I feel like I always bring a little bit more than usual, but there's too much

Tayson: tell you what, though, tasting was mentioning the last day of the hike being the longest, because you're kind of just asking yourself. Oh, when when are we going to be done and get out of here? Everyone always wants to talk about food on the way to tell you what. I mean, that was a pretty motivating factor for me, thinking about that cheeseburger. And when we get back to town cruising through that last day,

Brigham: I think too for me, like I know we were always Gonna Be by water so I don't I brought more food that I could, like, boil water and cook and things like that. Where is one? We're not by water all the time and stuff like that. I'm bringing like bar. I don't know. I guess. I'm thinking about it a little bit more. Where is this? My God. Like his boy water makes something anywhere I want to. So that's kind of just throw that extra thing. A noodles in there, whatever it might have been, you know what I mean?

Tayson: I like to have I like to have maybe like one or two meals worth of food extra like in the end if I Like look at what I have left if I have maybe enough for one or two meals tops, that's kind of like where I'd like to be. I'd rather have a little extra than Have any feeling of hunger whatsoever

Brigham: and I think for me, too, I have dehydrated meals for breakfast and I wasn't eating them. So I probably had three extra dehydrated meals because I just, I don't know, I just didn't eat them, I was eating bars or snacks or I was like, snacking on. Trail mix or something and said eating those bigger portion dehydrated meals. So, that was really why I had a lot of I don't know for some reason out maybe because I was like a little elevation sickness or something, but I was in a appetite or some reason.

Tayson: Yeah. Darren the the guy I don't know how to even Freight we need to we need to come up with a name for the amount of cans and Hawaiian Haystack boy. That's a really.

Brigham: Yes, it's my comfort food. You know you guys are going there for the side. So I'm going there for a specific goal but I want to be Happy all doing it too. So I I knew I'd be packing extra weight and it was a sacrifice that I'd really I was willing to do because I knew as soon as I ate it I'd be packing out with a lot less weight. So Hawaiian haystacks one night. These guys give me, you know, a lot of grief for, you know, bringing up cans of like cream of chicken or something like that. Like, one night, I had beef stew. That was just in the can it was so good while you guys are eating your dehydrated meals. I had a hearty meal like potatoes. Carrots beef. I was good you know, and that was a lot of weight that was out of my pack within the first two days.

Tayson: So he started at 40 pound base weight, okay, total weight

Brigham: so I worked off those calories obviously but it was definitely worth it for me. I knew I was getting myself into and I have no regrets. No regrets.

Tayson: Oh I I also had no regrets and honestly there's some videos that we've done in the past about, you know, packaging up your food. You know, shooting for about 130 calories per ounce and then packing about a pound and a half of food per day in the winter months that my creep up towards two pounds of food a day. But I'm telling it if you watch those, it really helps. I've also learned over time and this is something I would just advise you to do is Like like it's good to pack off a list for food, it really is. But but realized that Some things you just don't want to eat anymore. So for me there's a specific kind of bar that's that's well known and I won't badmouth or anything like that. But like if I pack those anymore and I pull it out, I'm just like, oh my stomach just suddenly doesn't feel hungry and so I like to bring a lot of snacky things, you know, trail mix is extremely high, caloric. I love that but also bring like, yogurt covered raisins. Dried mangoes dried. Oh, this was, this is the biggest treat for me on this time. So, first time I've kind of done this is I just bought dark doves, dark chocolate. I brought peanut butter packets. Just those little one single-use ones and then I also had dried bananas. I really like bring dried bananas this little banana chips. Cheap light and I was just putting peanut butter on the most dried bananas and eating them. And then I sometimes I put the chocolate out and eat the chocolate with the bananas and just little just little things like that. I've really, really come to enjoy when I'm backpacking. I don't think I really packed out much extra. I always pack out a little bit extra and what I usually like to do packing in those one gallon sized Ziploc bags is anything I don't eat from the day before I just take it out at the end of the day and put it in my next days bag. And so if I had leftover chocolate or banana chips or trail, mix it just rolls into my next day's bag and so I can eat more if I, if I want to the next day. But yeah, I really enjoyed that I think on this trip. Oh, this trip was was one of the first times. I've eaten idahoan, potatoes, those packets. And I really like the ones with the bacon in them, the Applewood smoked bacon Idaho. The tape really, really was a fan of that, super cheap I had during like lunch. Like, one day, I like, all right, I'm gonna see if I can go back to Ramen, like people ate Ramen man. The day that I ate Ramen, I was starving the day that I, the Idaho potatoes, I felt extremely full and they just really feel you up calories wise. It's only like 4 4, 0. 0, 0, That's kind of the feedback I have on food. I think the big thing there though, it to learn from it is is just Planning ahead is definitely going to keep you from over packing or under packing on the food. And that. That can be said with everything. These two things like two directions. I want to go here. But but while I'm on this subject, I really I really, really believe that that when you're packing for an Ultra Lite trip like this or just a backpacking trip in general, let's say the worst way to go from ultralight to lightweight, or lightweight to traditional. As far as your weights go, is to start throwing things in, as you're headed out the door. So, anything that's not on your list days in advance. Should never get added to your backpack, you know, the night before the, on the way, out the door or whatever that is. And unless you've already planned that as a contingency, then maybe I can see that, you know, where we kind of looked it up and said, oh man, we need to, we need to go to a contingency plan here or this or that, but that is the quickest way and the quickest way that I've seen myself or other people really add a quick five to ten pounds to their pack in minutes if not second. So just wanted to touch on that. Any other feedback on that for a move on to a different topic. All head nods. Okay, let's talk about water filters for a second and usually I'm a big like Sawyer squeeze type water filter. Gravity filter systems. I really appreciate those like them. Particularly like my gravity filter system into a bladder. This time I went with a couple smart water bottles and titanium bottle and it was not as fun to filter, the water in that way. As with the gravity filter system, I was very appreciative that Dave brought a his MSR Suite water and that's the second time he's second or so time, he's done that on trips. But there is something to be said about having a filter like that for large groups. Because we would pull that thing out filter, 10 liters of water for everyone in Camp and then put it away. I think everyone was pretty name thankful for that water filter. Yeah,

Brigham: I mean it's a little bit heavier and you get home. If you have to kind of clean it out and take a little bit more care of it. But I think for larger groups, it's it's definitely definitely worth it and there's even one out, I don't know. But larger than that for even larger groups, I think that size one that we have is probably not for the size of the group, we have bought. Yeah, it's definitely, I love it. Suppose the boiling water even or something like that. You get to Camp.

Tayson: Yeah. I definitely appreciate it. I like the Sawyer squeezes and stuff, but I do prefer to use them with my gravity filter system versus just squeezing. Squeezing squeezing squeezing into a bottle. That's you're struggling to keep up right? Or or so on so forth. So I appreciate that. I like, I like that. Type of a filter when we've got a large group. So okay, last thing I kind of wanted to touch on is just the jacket, The Loft tech jacket. So I I pretty much use. I had a long sleeve wool shirt. Off tech jacket. And then I had a really lightweight rain jacket and I wore that Loft tech jacket a lot. And just just really, really enjoyed it. The flexibility of it. I wore it in the snow. Actually, I I wore my rain jacket for a second and then it quit breathing and I you know, quit snowing and it wasn't breathing for me, I'm starting to sweat from me inside so I pulled it off just for that. Loft tech jacket in, just just really enjoyed it. I this this type of scenario, where you just actively moving a lot, we were moving Camp every night, you know, things like that. I think that's where where Loft Tech really shines over, say it down, jacket or some of these. Others, but he's wearing one of those last tech, jackets the entire trip. And on that first day, when you put on your your rain jacket, I didn't do anything. I just went with just the Loft Tech. As my outer layer and it's right. You got kind of go, we're getting rained, getting rained on and snowed on and I never got cold, and I never got cold once. I could see where in parts of the jacket on the shoulders and upper arms, where it's more exposed to the Rain, Where it was starting to soak through and it kind of started to penetrate the dwr coding. But by the end of the trip or by the end of the hike, by the, when we got to Camp, I was completely dry. Completely warm the whole time. And so, definitely was impressed with performance of the jacket and I've been using it for a long time but I did not need a rain jacket at all. And I thought that was convenient. Yeah, I for those of you, I mean, a lot of you probably listening to this already have a jacket but I the feedback I always get is the more that people use them, the more they liked him. So if you've got a jacket go take it out and use it. It's Um, gear wise, I think that covers it for me. I think we've touched on the alcohol stove, part a little bit on our YouTube channel. If you want to go see that, go check it out. This is one of the first trips. I used an alcohol stove, absolutely loved it. And I've been using it ever since even even in the fourth season conditions that I've been camping in more recently, love the alcohol stove. And, and yeah, I just just overall, the gear was good. We were testing some other prototypes and things. We didn't really mention here that I won't mention just yet, but are definitely in the pipe Pipeline and performed really, really well. Super excited. To be able to announce those in the early part of next year. You make it some other teasers kind of coming out about some of those other products. But any last call for, for inputs overall that we like to trip. Did we, you know, anything? I would actually say one of the best pieces of gear that I was thankful. I brought was that

Brigham: Of like sunshade thermal

Tayson: material. Yeah.

Brigham: I get. I don't know what we had. I had

Tayson: like a car like a car reflective.

Brigham: Yeah. It's like this. Yeah. And I just cut a piece of that and I brought it with me because I wanted to keep the eyes of my pole from getting like damaged. So I just wrapped it around my, my pole, but I want to hold my fishing pole like I had it. Oh yeah, I had it wrapped around there, but I want to use that to sit on it when like the ground was wet and Neil on it and you like feel that little piece of plastic on up. Having a lot of uses.

Tayson: Yeah, I brought a Z, I think that was the first time I used my zc seat and oh, I was definitely thankful that I was a seat.

Brigham: Yeah, I mean, same concept. Just

Tayson: yeah, I had zc and I was I was jealous of your house. Like, I swear you. Were you just had it out? Yeah.

Brigham: Like, you know, sitting around a launch or something. Like trying to dry my feet out. It's like like that.

Tayson: Yeah. I To me is very small. I don't think I have a massive, but it just feels real small. And, and I think the main thing is like, sometimes you want to take your feet out of your boots and not put them on the ground, you want to put them on the pad with you or things like that. And so, I think I'm Legit going to look at getting an actual like pad, maybe an accordion style pad and cutting it in half or something, something like that and and making it so that it's just A bigger version of kind of a z z, but overall, I think, you know, those that had them were very thankful for their seats. I know that I loaned my out to I think it's Ethan and or just, you know, people were just

Brigham: Works a good fan for us, Fire Starter.

Tayson: Yeah, butts out of the snow or just just so on and so forth and then what I always do To his, almost always take my if I have a pad like that and I'll just shove it underneath the hips section of my pad. It's just the most highly likely place for me to get cold from my pads side from like, underneath my body and so I don't know. I was just something I always do is I always take that pad shove it underneath my air chamber pad just for an extra little r value in my hip area but Definitely a very usable piece. Okay, going once going twice. All right, so thanks for joining us again. On the Liverpool. Try podcast. Make sure you're subscribed to our YouTube channel. I kind of mentioned that the alcohol stove stuff where that we posted on there. We've we're always trying to post this much content as we can on our YouTube channel and and whatnot. This will probably post after our main holiday sale but make sure you get on our email list as well, so that we can update you of other potential sales to inform you of some of the gear. We test it on this trip. That I'm really, really excited for next year. There's a lot of really cool stuff. I think that we're gonna be releasing in 2020, so super, super stoked for it and we'll be doing podcasts as we release those as well to kind of Stories of the design process on a lot of those but yeah, thanks for joining us today. If you do have questions, make sure to to ask us, please leave us a review. Other you're on, you know, Stitcher iTunes, wherever you're at. Spotify does a reviews as well and then if you have any questions hop over to our website, catch us on our chat feature on the website if before live will answer instantly. If we're not we'll send you an email as soon as we're back in the office. But yeah, let us know. We love questions. We'll do our best to answer questions on the podcast live and we'll sign off for now.

Brigham: If you'd like to help us spread the word about the live ultralight lifestyle, please give us a five-star review and tell your friends to subscribe. We're available on Apple podcast Spotify, Stitcher, and have you made your listening app as well as live ultralight, calm. So, thanks for listening.