Tayson: so here's the big question, how do we lighten our gear and build our confidence so that we can start living a life full of Outdoor Adventures and memories without having unlimited amounts of time, money and previous experience, that's the big question and we are here to help you find the Answer. This is the little trolley podcast power, bi Outdoor Vitals. Hey, welcome to the Live Ultralight podcast for super excited to have you back here today, we have a really fun episode.
Tayson: It's gonna be kind of just that it's gonna be a thought experiment. It's gonna be us playing around with some different ideas and hopefully just having a lot of fun with this. So, to dive into the topic. The topic today is going to be if you have 500 dollars right now to invest into packing equipment, what would you spend it on our website specifically Auto vitals? So if you know most of us are going to be coming out this from the
Tayson: perspective of I'm a new Backpacker, I don't have much gear, but if you did not do that, will preface that. So that it makes a little bit more sense. But before we dive into the topic and start going through the different picks that everyone here has, let's go kind of go around the circle, have everyone introduce themselves, and kind of explain what you do here, at Outdoor Vitals. So, starting with Derek. Yeah, I'm Derek rasps and I'm the marketing director. I
Tayson: do a little bit of kind of everything is an online company. So you know whether that's email marketing, some of the ads, the photography videography, landing pages and our websites. Look that's that's kind of basically my realm of kind of what things I cover. So yeah, that's me.
Dave: I'm Dave and if you listen to the podcast, I'm sure you're probably familiar with me. I do the customer service side of things and shipping Logistics side of things.
Tayson: And Brigham. I'm on the design side. And I have a little bit of an advantage with this exercise because I know what's coming in. What's oh, you think things out ahead of schedule here? It's just part of the planing. Oh, We may have to edit some of these things out that aren't supposed to be to close disclosed yet so sweet. So got a quick intro. So, let's just kind of dive a little bit further in here. I'm probably gonna go last
Tayson: just because I don't want to mess anyone up on different thoughts that they have but also, I can pick and choose from their lists know. We're trying to keep our own lists our own. So I've had a little, there's three of us here talked a little bit about this before. So I may have Dave go first on his list since he's been untainted by any of the thoughts that we had. So, Dave Dive Right on drive right in explain a little
Tayson: bit about like are you gonna be coming out this from perspective of a brand new Backpacker, are you coming up this? From the perspective of you know you backpacked a little bit and then kind of dive into your picks.
Dave: I'm gonna call him into it as a brand new Backpacker. So I guess my thought process was if I could get most of the essentials through I'm going to use our website for instance like particularly and then the other thing is like shoes clothing. Where anything like that. I'm gonna go third party. So I'll go with my website picks right now. It was a little bit easier for me because we have a bunch of our clearance stuff on the website, so
Dave: like refurbished stuff and things like that. And At some point in the last week. I don't know if it's on when this website on this podcast comes out. Not sure if it'll still be on there, but as of this week, this is the stuff that we have, and this is the prices, so I don't know. That's cheating it out, but that's what I'm going off of our clearance page slash refurbished use stuff. So my first take item is our bound 15
Dave: degree top quilt. That's typically what I use or less for backpacking. So this was a bonus, so that comes in at 160 dollars. My next will be a six-sided tarp. Ideally a tarp isn't what I would use but I think for this process, this is what I'm going to use until I can save up enough to get 10th. Ideally, a one-person tent would be my sleep shelter of choice so I'm going to go with the six-sided talk for now that came
Dave: in at 55 dollars. And I'm also going to go with the idea that we are in. The Southwest. So one I'm not super worried about rain and two on super not worried about bugs so I think if know you're in the East Coast or no Northeast South taught probably wouldn't be my go-to but that's what I got went with this next would be a regular insulated sleeping pad So, that came in at 70 dollars. The next one will be more full price. Is
Tayson: that, is that a clearance item? That's
Dave: a clear inside. Okay. So clearance pad 70 dollars and then I think they're regularly hundred dollars. I'm not sure they are regularly but so that's a clearance item. Next, I went with the pre-ordered shadowlight, so I feel like at the 150 price point and that's a great deal. I don't think I'm gonna find an ultralight backpack at that price. I don't know if that's necessarily cheating because you technically need to be a member that's going to cost me an extra 10
Dave: dollars. Did you factor in fact that over? But yes, so if you remember, you can get the backpack at 150 dollars as posted. 200 dollars. So that is 150. So up to this point I'm at about 435 my next item will be titanium pot which is 30 and my last item will be a gas stove, which will be 40. I know a couple guys here like to use the alcohol stoves. Personally, not for me. I'm typically either boiling water to make
Dave: coffee or I'm blowing water to use a rehydrated meal. Those are the only really things I'm doing and I don't know. I just don't like the way it around. I don't mind a little bit of extra weight for the gas or the time. So impatient Millennials
Dave: that's my 500 dollars. Yeah for sure that's in the morning if I want a hot drink so that's my 500 dollars on like The big items. I would say a website items. Some other things that I am going to need, but I either have to find it on the house or something like that as for like a spoon to eat. I'll just take a plastic spoon from Wendy's. Cookware, like my spoon pork? If I need it, so I'll just do that
Dave: for a spoon as for a drink or bottle. I'll just do like a smart water bottle so that's like two boxes. Another thing that I'll have to take into consideration is I guess filter filtering, my water or tabs my water. But I can boil my water with my pot and stove that I bought. So I mean, that would probably be if I had to, I would just have to boil the water. If not, I'll save up and get filter tabs personally.
Dave: I like the pump filters and other definitely way more, but that's probably what I would go with is a pump filter.
Tayson: You like those pump filters because you haven't been out on the trail with us since we all started using the katadyn filter. Yeah.
Dave: I use a sawyer in the past many. And I don't, personally like them, I saw, and I also feel like, every time I go with this group, I'm like using my phone. So, I don't know. I just, I think it's just, we
Tayson: finally bought there because I'm filters. So he's and everyone else's for. So he's probably both Derek, excuse me, Dave and Brigham's, filters to exhaustion and he finally got his own. So
Dave: yeah, I like it a lot. Just filled in water fast as the last few times, I've been backpacking with groups, and I like it living. That's a little bit of annoying part of it. Maintaining it when you get home and drying it and cleaning it. And the only thing I guess, I don't like
Tayson: the pump filter but besides for that, it's pretty. Exhaustive list. You got there. So what was the grand total on everything that you spend on the website?
Dave: If I went with, if I had to pay for the membership would be 515.
Tayson: Yes. 15 over. So minus the membership I was 505 dollars. Okay,
Dave: I'm sure I could figure out a way to get a five dollar. Well actually if I can remember right,
Tayson: it's a membership that's discount and then that dollars actually isn't it cost because you get to spend that on our gear. So that's 10% off free discount space. Yeah,
Dave: so I guess I could probably just I'm sure everybody has enough quote like some kind of clothing. They wanted to get out of people that just go to the thrift store. And they get their backpacking clothes from like that climbing clothes, and stuff like that. And then shoes, I've actually been really lucky with shoes and boots from Ariana Grande sales. Personally, I like the word troll on us. Been able to get off. A few pair of those for super cheap so
Dave: that I think around like everything I would need. To get out the door.
Tayson: Yes. Yeah, I think that was probably more extensive than my list. I don't know. That was, I kind of went through the 500 dollars, had a few additional notes and was over. So I think that's pretty good list. So to cap out kind of the big things you bought just in a recap. You bought a clearance, top quilt, a clearance pad, a Shadowlight backpack. Those are kind of the big purchases, but that's my life. So
Dave: excited. Tarp tell us I saved up. That's not ideal. But again out there.
Tayson: Yeah, no, I think that's, that's pretty good Insight. I forgot. I didn't even think about clearance. Yeah, I like that. You did that because that's,
Tayson: Shopping. Honestly, you can make a you can make your money. Go a long ways. Well, and kind of like
Dave: a Hot Topic right now. Here's what we've been doing. So that's like fun of my my mind and then when I went over and talked to you guys before, briefly set of all big ticket items in the late. Yeah,
Tayson: that's just gonna say, is this podcast should come out pretty close to our Black Friday. So, which all right. Sure. If it's gonna be a Black Friday sale. At this point, we have a full container worth of goods. Just Sitting at the Port. It's been there for weeks. We have no idea when it's gonna come. It's been a it's been a kind of a disaster for us to say the least. So we will run a holiday sale but we may have
Tayson: to quit calling it a Black Friday. So so this podcast will likely come out around that time frame. Although in none of our calculations to my knowledge, did we use those prices in our calculations? So all right. Brigham, Derek you guys can rock paper scissors for who goes first. Go ahead. All right, well first thing I thought of when I was thinking about the 500 dollars, I get to spend was the membership did kind of hard to cover that but I
Tayson: put ten dollars down which I would get automatically back. So it's like I hadn't even spent the ten dollars and then I would get all of these discounts and everything else I want to buy still. So that would be the first thing. I go sign up for the membership and automatically get a free bonus with that. So, the next thing that I'm kind of focusing on here would be a backpack, have a new Shadow like backpacks that are currently on sale
Tayson: for 50 dollars less than the regular price and so I would jump on that deal as soon as possible in order that backpack. And so, that's 150 dollars. And then, the next thing I had was and also 15 degree down, top quilt. That's kind of also what I use for pretty much every trip and it's super versatile. 15 degree. Temperature range is something that I could use on pretty much any climate any environment. I'm going to for the most part, even
Tayson: in the summer, when it's hot, you can still vent out a lot with the top quilts. And so that with the membership discount ends up, costing 94 dollars right now with the current prices and $194. Oh yeah, sorry 194. So my notes wrong there. So 150 for the Shadowlight 194 for the Talco and those are the most expensive things I'm getting. But I am saving 50 dollars on that backpack in over 20 dollars on the top quilt just by being
Tayson: a member Well, the next thing was actually the sleeping pad. That's a big thing for me with a regular insulated pad. I can get that for 84 dollars with the membership discount. And so that would be the next thing I'd grab after that is A latte jacket actually right now, we have a few sizes left of our first batch of jackets and those ones are only 60 dollars and then add the membership discount to that. That would only cost me about
Tayson: 50 four dollars. And so, I am totally fine with getting our first batch of that Jack is, there's a few issues with them sizing wise and then you have some issues with on some of them where the fill will start leaking through the shell. But For me, and my experience, basically, the only Loft Tech jackets that I have used at least use very much on backpacking trips or just wearing around anywhere are prototypes. So they are kind of aligned with that
Tayson: first batch and I have only had good experience with that. So I'm totally fine with just getting that first batch of spending more on the brand new, most updated current version and so After the satellite, a 15 degree top wheel. And these are all brand new things, a new pad, and that first batch jacket. I actually still have twenty dollars left because I give that to Dave. Yeah,
Dave: I have 50 extra dollars if I got the membership.
Tayson: Oh wow. Okay. Same that's a huge thing. Yeah, I'm plus
Tayson: yes. So that that membership is used because that ten dollars you think you're spending that at the beginning. You're actually not because every member gets that right back. I gotta jump in product right away.
Dave: 65, yeah. I just I just got a job in here. I did not plan this
Tayson: podcast to be a sales pitch on the membership or anything. I thought I planted out to be a thought experiment and I'll kind of explain why in some of the things that I chose just ways to save some money, right? But these guys, let us let their use the membership and I was just like, how did I get that? That would say so much money is I'm looking at my list and different things. So essentially, if you plan to buy anything
Tayson: from us, the membership is only going to benefit you because and I'll get to this in mind, but you just don't lose that money. It just turns into store credit, but okay. It's hard to catch off back to you. Oh yeah, no worries. It's really like, the membership is the biggest deal. I think that like I said, the very first thing I thought about, but that's pretty much everything. I was spend that 500 dollars on and I actually feel pretty confident
Tayson: and ready to go out on the trip. As you know, a Backpacker having gone out before, like Dave mentioned in the southwest. I'm not really concerned about bugs or rains so much, so I personally, Cowboy Camp. I don't even use a tart. So, with the top grill, the pad and a jacket and a backpack, Find around my house. I'd be able to go anywhere. I want out here in the southwest as long as I check the weather before and just throw
Tayson: out a pad and cowboy camp. And I'd be, I'd be all set. I would eventually want to save up and get a tarp shelter or a tent. Preferably actually, you know, some of our upcoming tens we've teased. I'd be really interested in our new trekking, pole tent. Like I said, that'd be something. I'd have to save up for in the future. But as of right now, with the things about, I could just go just gonna say you always Cowboy Camp, anyways.
Tayson: I had to make it a rule that he needed to bring a footprint. Just didn't pop any pads or anything, because these are just sleep right on the rocks at this pad. So we got caught us
Dave: and I just had The tarp which thank God I did.
Tayson: Well for years people have been like, why don't you guys make a busy? Why don't you make a busy? And I was always like, I hate babies and every time I've tried to sleep in one I haven't enjoyed it. So we bought this or Outdoor Research bivy just for R&D purposes. We talked Dave into using it on this trip.
Dave: Had that and just a tart. But yeah.
Dave: I guess. Yeah. If there's some good video footage
Tayson: of this on our YouTube channel, you have to find some time and but now that yeah that would be that proves
Dave: that that's all you really need is like I'm really need a good solid tarp pitched. Right can do a
Tayson: lot and we do we I know we've been out of stock for a little while on our tarps Brigham did a few changes and modifications to our tops and we'll be getting them in. Oh, probably January, ish, around that time. We'll try to put out some videos. Maybe about different ways to pitch tarps and use tarps, but they're really versatile piece and it really can be all that you need and in a lot of the scenarios at least out here in
Tayson: the west. So Cool that we wrap up everything for you then Derek. Yeah, no, that's that's everything for me. So, to quickly recap you got the shadowlight. You gotta 15 degree top quilt. Yeah, down top quilt and then you have a insulated pad. Yeah. I if I thought about, you know, going to route but with clearance I was at, you know, even more money could asli got a tarp as well. Yeah, but yeah, that was all brand new stuff and all
Tayson: that within the 500 dollars, you also brought to my attention that they can get these jackets for a really good price, so we may need to raise the price on those. Not one of the size of For me. So yeah. Okay. All right, break them. I think you are up. Okay, mine was from the perspective of not a new Backpacker, just I'm a Backpacker. I have equipment already, but I've got 500 dollars to to spend on stuff at Outdoor Vitals. So,
Tayson: This is definitely not a list. From starting from nothing. I take it more in terms of a shop individual items at a time, I look for deals with something is a good deal or value taking into account, like the what's something, typically costs, if it's on a sale, then I'll jump on it. That that's kind of my mentality. So the first thing Would be the membership. That's kind of a no-brainer. When you start with, you know, 500 dollars, you get 10%
Tayson: off of that. So Membership 10 dollars. And I didn't even think that I get to spend that 10 dollars like that, so I get to add out of bonus piece so membership and then I would go straight in. Order the shadow, light 45 liter 150 bucks. That's a no-brainer and that one's a no-brainer of full price. also, so Next I did, they 15 degree top quilt with the 10% off from the membership, so that gets me 19350 for that. And then
Tayson: I went and grabbed the regulator Because it's on sale right now on the website, plus my 10% off, puts it at 141, 30, and a jacket with Hyper dried down. It's a warm warm jacket. I don't think it's it's like so that was kind of the one that I couldn't pass up like looking for that deal where it's like, that's a down jacket. I know the materials are really really got really high quality, so that kind of took up the bulk
Tayson: except that I got 10 bucks to spend on my long handle spoon. that is necessity for me, I'm realizing that most guys, in this office, use prototype's, G1 stuff like old stuff and maybe we need to build it into Some kind of a program where you guys get some credit of your own for working here every month because that's like a lot of you guys. Like don't have our newest jacket, you like covet the jacket but you're like used to getting
Tayson: stuff for free because sometimes I will just be like hey go take one or So I think we need to figure out a system because I think there's a lot of stuff. You guys want to be wearing that? You like us and they just gonna get one handed to me at some point, am I gonna get a prototype at some point because you just get a lot of different prototypes through the R&D
Dave: process so Focus. Sometimes they're like unique color. Like
Tayson: oh yeah, that's one. That's one of my favorites. Yeah. In fact Brigham that last jacket from Tori like the oranges peach color. Yeah, my wife took that and everyone comments on it all of her friends wanted I'm like she's gotta make this jacket. I'm like, just a random product, I don't know what that color is. Like, that's a lot of guys around here. Get unique colored stuff that's for sure. Okay. All right. So again, you got the satellite, you got a
Tayson: 15 degree top quilt again. I think that's three for three on 15 degree top quilts. And then you got the regulator jacket and then A spoon. Is that everything? Yeah, yeah, that top quilt, man. I just just has the broadest application. Like, you can cover the most bases geographically seasonally with that, 15 degree top coat. It's a good one to have.
Dave: That's my goal. Even if we aren't doing this, it was like, what's one item that you buy use? Like for everything. That's the time. I want to be in hammocks. Sometimes even if it's hot, you can still use that, you know, he just Even off you a little bit or something. So the top coat is my favorite bag. For sure that we
Tayson: gotta get some stock build up on those because those are in a super hot product. This whole year, like we've been playing catch up this whole year, just trying to keep up with the level of demand. We've had on this top quilts, but starting in my gear list. I'm different than every one of you. I took a loft Tech 15 degree top quilt. So really make some it up there. I just did that to save a little bit of money. But
Tayson: again, starting from the top, I too signed up for the membership to get that additional savings. I obviously, when you sign up, you actually get a Drifter backpack. So, I get that in my gear list as well right now, but I'm gonna, I'm gonna throw this out there and customer service will hate me for it. But I would email the company, right? As I signed up and said, could I change my Drifter backpack for the stretch pillow? Just because I'm trying
Tayson: to build up my gear system right now, right? And so, I really like the pillow, I can use that in my gear setup. So I sign up for the membership, I'm gonna request a pillow in The Drifter, hopefully, they see that before they ship stuff out because they're so fast that shipping stuff out. So that's the first thing I get, I get the Loft Tech top quilt. The reason I got the Loft Tech, top quilt is yes, it's going to be
Tayson: more heavy, but if I've only got 500 dollars to spend I feel like I'm probably on a budget and The top quilt. It's It doesn't use quite as much insulation. So going from synthetic to down. There's not as much weight savings as like, a full sleeping bag would be going from synthetic to down. So I thought, alright with that. So my costs on that, after my discount is only 161, that's the long wide version. So, save a little bit of money
Tayson: on that, I would need the long wide rectangular pad to me. That's kind of a must and I'm definitely coming at this for at the perspective of a very new Backpacker. Maybe I'm an outdoor person but not a camper as much or a Backpacker. And to me it's just extremely valuable to get good sleep and that pad is just critical for me to sleep good to have just a thick enough pad to keep me off the ground but sleeping on my
Tayson: side. So that's something was like critical one of the first things I put in. the other piece was the backpack, and I actually thought about Can I use a different backpack or less money? You know, if I was to say, I didn't buy the backpack from Outer battles and bought it somewhere else. And really when I thought about it, like maybe I could get a backpack for a hundred dollars somewhere but it would be a fraction of the pack just because
Tayson: one of the savings are directed consumer and stuff like this pack should cost $300 easy with with a Dynamo or the sector ripstop and things of that nature. The Fabrics like this pack in a retail store would easily be 300 dollars to pick it up for 150. That was another thing that I just I just couldn't pass up as it sounds like all of you guys did the same. So I've got the backpack Shadow like backpack, got the path. Loctek top
Tayson: quilt that puts me at 421 dollars, but I also forgot that my ten dollars that I spent in credit on the membership, I get back. So I'm actually at what 400 111 dollars. And then from there, I kind of took the approach of all right, let me grab the cabinet on water filter. Let me grab the toaks, titanium pot and then I actually have $20 left over at that point. So I would probably pick up a spoon or a couple Peak
Tayson: refuel meals or something like that. Now, I did not cover the fact that I didn't have a shelter. So my thought personally would be I know that Outdoor Vitals is going to be coming out with a trekking, pole tent. Now that I'm a member, I'm going to be building up a little bit of credit for that, but they'll probably launch it on pre-sell at a discount. So I'm just going to save up a little bit of money pick that up. Hopefully
Tayson: in the spring and be well on my way with that but in the meantime I'm going to probably go to Walmart and I'm gonna buy like a ten dollar cheap tarp and that's going to keep rain and snow off me if I absolutely have to. So if I'm just going super, super cheap. The other thing about this is that it talk about anything clothing wise, but I did mention that I've, you know, been in the outdoors a little bit and To
Tayson: me, you can be extremely Budget on clothes if you have to be, there's great advantages to spending a lot of money on clothes. I mean, just performance-wise weight-wise all those things but I don't know. Technically, you could probably layer up with a bunch of super cheap fleece, you know, sweaters and different things. Just avoiding anything cotton in my closet. I'd literally just go through my cotton look for the type of fabric that I feel would be best applicable. So let's say,
Tayson: I don't have any wool but I could avoid cotton and I could find some polyester t-shirts and, you know, find a pair of pants that might be nylon or some different things like that. I feel like you could pull together, easy enough clothing, that would get you out there and still allow you to have a great trip. Yes. A lot of our clothes and jackets and stuff that's coming out. They're amazing. If you're using it a lot and you've got the
Tayson: budget but to me like having that pad is going to make me want to go backpack. More than having a really nice puffy coat. For instance, having that top quilt. And set of like a super cheap sleeping bag. It's going to make me want to go backpacking more than again, having like Merino wool base layer or something. So that was my perspective. I also kind of wanted to get creative with this to because If I was to stretch this out it
Tayson: is winter right now, pretty much for us. And so another cool thing that I always think about with top quilts is they give you a ton of Versatility to mix and match. So I've taken top quilts and I've put on them, put them inside of sleeping bags to double layer things when it gets really cold and that works super well. So for instance, during our clearance sale, we had some of these old Obi lights. These synthetic sleeping bags will be years
Tayson: ago. You know, if you picked up like a 35 degree rated OV light, super lightweight bag, and you took that 15 degree top quilt inside of that thing, it would really add a ton of warmth and you could totally take that into the fourth season and it would be super cheap to do. Because the bulk of your insulation is coming from that top quilt, you just kind of adding some extra with cheaper synthetic. So I think that's a really cool option
Tayson: and even if I had to go back back and right now, I'd probably still do the same system because it would be the best thing for my buck. It's the most versatile piece. 15 degree. Loft quilt plastic top quilt and I would, you know, I don't know, find something else to just, add to it to stretch it in this fourth season, or to put the locked up quilt, inside of something else to stretch it into this fourth season. So that is
Tayson: my my gear list. Should we do honorable mentions? Yes, I sure. Yeah. Somebody else because I was an example of honorable, mentions.
Tayson: Yeah. Well, I only call them that because they're ones that I wrote down and then crossed out, okay? As I was working out. So I crossed out a regular insulated pad. Then off because the number discount 8550 and then I wrote down, and then crossed out be free filter. Yeah, because that one is just money. It's like a broken record. I can't,
Dave: you know what? That with the cost of that is so
Tayson: with the discounted Before 40 dollars and fifty cents. 35 dollars.
Tayson: Yeah, I have 20 dollars left, but that's honestly, that's the only honorable mention that I've been thinking about is just be free man, ever since I got my own filter here, I've been living the dream. So that would be. That would be the next thing save up. I think you've been living the dream ever since I met you Derek. Every time I asked how you are, you're living the dream. So
Dave: yeah, I feel It's actually a tarp like really confidently. That's a really good list that I would be really comfortable. With like full-time. Like not even I call. This is a headless okay, everything I'm like.
Tayson: Let me ask this if you had to buy because most of us, put something down, out of like the big three, right? Like a shelter system, a Sleep System or a Pac system. if you were to buy one of those big three first, like, if you're gonna invest in one of those big three first, where you invest it, Like most of us didn't put it in the shelter. other than, but I think that's all because where we live and we
Dave: used to like, For the most part like nice nicer weather, like, in the winter but three seasons. Bug wise,
Dave: bug wise and just I feel you asked someone on the Southeast or, you know, but
Dave: I would say I would probably spend it personally on a bag, probably
Tayson: That's literally why Outdoor Vitals started with sleeping bags. I was literally in the market to get into ultralight backpacking in the biggest weight, savings bulk savings and things that I felt like were just make the trip more enjoyable for me at that time was a sleeping bag. I did buy a pack, but sleeping bags were so expensive but they had like this, this I just like they would provide like because I'm always slept cold and I always, you know, just Had
Tayson: a huge huge bag. It wasn't something you could backpack with. And so that was that was the first thing I was literally shopping for. And that's kind of how I was born, is a started sourcing those and finding those and then it all took off from there, but
Dave: I think my thought process in the shower, I was the same, like, yeah, you could probably get a cheaper bag for like, 80 to 100 dollars, but it's not even gonna be well, that's just when I have this first. Starting out, backpacking. I think the thing that kind of it me and I didn't take into consideration was the past like the first time. It immediately bought a new one. Like that was like the first thing. I immediately bought a good. as
Dave: I said, Since. The first time Backpacker, that would be. Piece of advice that I get is, but the thing is even going back to what I was just saying about sleeping
Tayson: bags. I too, I bought a cheaper pad in. Probably one of the worst mistakes I've ever ever ever made with gear. Bought a pad that was an acclaimed, our value of like three. I can guarantee it wasn't because it was so thin that your hips would hit the ground or whatever. Then there's no water value, right? So it wasn't comfortable, it wasn't very insulated and then I was putting good bags on top of it. And I was still cold. And and
Tayson: that's like the biggest takeaways just recognize that doesn't matter how nice your sleeping bag is, putting it on a crappy pad is going to keep you cold or uncomfortable. So, yeah, I wish that literally like still Bugs me to this day. I think, like, my wife didn't backpack a whole lot with me, for a few years after I was starting out, go vitals and and we were backpacking, together, dating and stuff. And I think the main reason was we had these
Tayson: crappy pads, you know, one of the times when I went out it deflated and she slept on the ground was freezing. Still gets after me about this. I didn't realize that she was like, on the ground or maybe I did, but I was half asleep. And so she's always like, why didn't you give me your pad? And I was a mistake. I don't know what happened.
Dave: Even to this day, I'm like, what, what happened? Like, I thought that it was holding are
Tayson: or how to slowly because she blew it up once in the night. Anyways, it was
