EP 8 - Levi Pendleton, SUU Outdoors Coordinator Teaches Us How to Climb Denali

Transcript auto-generated with Google Speech-to-Text diarization and lightly cleaned for speaker names. Speaker labels use first names only.



Tayson: Here's the big question, how do we live a life? full of adventures, travel and memories on our terms without being millionaires without previous experience? And without unlimited amounts of time, that's the big question and this podcast will give you the answers. I'm your co-host Tayson and I'm Dave and you're listening to the live

Dave: ultralight podcast powered by Outdoor Vitals.

Tayson: All right, welcome to another

Dave: episode of the Live Ultralight podcast, today is a little bit different. We actually have our first in-studio interview, and we actually have two guests today. So, our first guest is Nicole. Nicole is a practicum student here at SUU, which is Southern Utah University at the local University in town here, and she is our practicum student. And what that is. It's kind of like many internship. We work with University and we take on a student or two every semester. And we had the idea for her practical this year to help us with the podcast. So she's helped get our second guest, which is Levi, you'll meet him in a minute. Set up the interview, she set up the questions and things like that. She's also going to help me with editing of the podcast and things like that. So, Nicole, if you want to tell us a little bit about yourself, how you got to Southern Utah, University, and why you chose to go here?

Nicole: Yeah. So I'm originally from upstate New York and I transferred to suu last semester primarily for the outdoor recreation parks and tourism major. So, originally started working in Bryce last summer, heard about suu and couldn't really pass up. The chance to go to university. That puts such an emphasis on outdoor recreation and setting myself up for a career in an industry. So So yeah, it's been great. Great to be here,

Dave: So awesome and then Levi, if you want to tell us a little bit about yourself.

Tayson: Yeah, I actually met leave. I'm just gonna jump in here. I met Levi, I was over speaking at the University. Swapping some stories with him and found him. Super interesting. You've done some crazy things. I feel like I thought they're crazy. So that's really why I wanted to bring you on the podcast is dive into some of your past experiences but if you want to give us a little background on yourself, that'd be great. Yeah definitely.

Levi: So I originally grew up in Northern Utah. I had a Roy So Ogden area I was a student here at suu once upon a time and I came here as a freshman and really got turned onto the outdoors that climbing wall over there. At the University was a big connection for me and kind of that outdoor community. And also just a sport in general of climbing and then opened up a lot of doors to make other connections. I spent a little time as a missionary and then came back. when I was, Back to issue trying to make the decision of what my major would be took a few more classes in the app direct program and ultimately decided that you know how to Reckless for me. And So, yeah, I finished the degree there and then spent a lot of time. After graduation kind of working in all sorts of different disciplines mainly Whitewater, guiding ski patrolling, and then spend some time doing a few other things. So, anywhere from working with the park service on, Denali up in Alaska, with on a Mountain, Rescue Patrol to guiding the Grand Canyon Moab, Jackson Hole Wyoming ski patrolling up at Snow Basin in Northern Utah. Spent Some time Zealand, keep it rolling over there and then ultimately was drawn back to Cedar City as a position. Came open with issue Outdoors. Coordinator position, I started that in August So I've been back in Cedar working at the University for about eight or nine months. Now

Dave: I'd say what what brought you back to see like why are you intrigued to come back here to this particular area? Back to the university? I'm sure with your background you could have probably went wherever. Is there anything in particular

Nicole: that?

Tayson: I mean you were in Alaska.

Levi: Yeah, exactly. So the position here, didn't come on to my radar until last winter and what had happened? Was Jake man, one of the professors and that demick program over there in the outdoor recreation program. We had become good friends and beyond graduation. We kept in touch And So I just call them up last winter to touch base jow with them. See how life is going and he said, hey, you know, the person that's in this position now, is likely gonna be moving on to something else? And this is some you might want to keep on your radar. So as I said yeah that yeah, I'm interested. I'm, you know, keep me posted and So he kind of kept me in the loop in the position came open. And yeah, it was kind of that decision of. Yeah. What you know, do I want to go for this, is this something that I want it would what it entails was essentially a big change in lifestyle. I mean, obviously it's a job that's outdoor oriented outdoor Focus. But from, you know, a little bit more of a transient lifestyle working seasonal work, you know, having a lot of opportunities time off to travel and kind of entertain my own hobbies, and passions would be changed somewhat. I always enjoyed my time here in Cedar. As a student, I have worked for sure, Outdoors, as a student employee, when I was here. So, I kind of had an idea what it was all about, and Originally when I had graduated working higher education, specifically, in outdoor recreation, was kind of my game plan, or at least a goal of mine. I made a couple of tips to grad school in the past. Up for similar type of position. Long story short, I didn't end up doing that, but yeah, I kind of saw this as that opportunity to kind of, you know, take a step in this direction. See if it was what I wanted. It was for me, and So yeah, after kind of thinking about a lot, weighing options, having lots of conversations, you know, interviewing going through that process. I was offered the job

Nicole: and

Levi: ultimately made the decision to go for it. Yeah, give it a shot. See if this is what what I want to do. So So

Dave: what would you say you're like, daily. What do you? What's your daily role? Sue Outdoors?

Levi: Yeah

Dave: position.

Levi: Yeah it it's funny because you know, some people as you guys might understand, you know, you round this company, they think you just go out and play all the time, you just Hiked for a living that's all you do. Well, as we all know those that are in the industry, it's a little bit more to it than that and the position, whether it's yours or similar to mine, as you know, a coordinator, there's a lot more kind of administrative tasks that happen and So my day-to-day spends a little The majority of it spent inside right now. It's I like to say that I'm Sue indoors So I can it's the outdoors and in a way not that I don't get outside and you know, you'll see me out doing trips and say you're lying. Like we'll just have fun.

Tayson: So, let me, let me ask you this because So when we do this practicum when we bring on a practicum student, yeah, I'll typically go and talk about Outdoor Vitals and how it's a great career path to these Outdoor Rec majors. And most of them don't get that excited about coming to Outdoor Vitals. And I'm always, like, what don't they get? And really, what it was down to is most of them have a vision of spending all day outside. Like,

Nicole: I

Tayson: don't want to be in an office, I don't want to be stuck in doors for my, for my career. I want to be outside all the time every day. So from someone, from your position, who's been Outside of every day almost. So if you're doing seasonal things like working rivers in the summer and skiing through the winter and then, you know, transferring into probably a little bit more indoor job at this point. What's that like? Is that a negative thing or is it a nice thing? Yeah, I don't know. Yeah, and

Levi: I think that the answer to that my vary depending on the person that you ask that to Oh, I guess when I speak for myself in this situation, I would say it's mostly been positive and I think that has to do with your attitude and your approach and your reason why you're doing what you're doing. Because the way I look at it is the reason I'm in the outdoor industry is because I genuinely enjoy helping people make connections with the outdoors that I've feel like I've been in a position to facilitate potentially life-changing, positive life-changing. Experiences that happen because of the outdoors. I know what happened for me and that's something that I enjoy and you feel maybe like a little bit more directly involved

Nicole: with

Levi: that process if you're, you know, a guide or You know, doing other things like that whereas now I still feel like I'm doing the same thing. I'm accomplishing the same goal but I feel like I almost have sometimes a little bit greater opportunity and impact more people on a broader scale as far as being in a little bit different position to where now I can make decisions and you know what the management of both employees being on trips dealing with a lot of students. I spend a lot of time touching base and connecting with a lot of people that in the one-on-one setting, sometimes you don't get as A big of a reach. So I feel like I'm accomplishing the same goals just in a little bit different way and I almost have the ability to create a lot more as far as what I want to do and what my vision might be for that instead of just having the job responsibilities lined out for you. Like this is where you're gonna do. That's you know you do that every time. Consistently whereas now I think there's a little more autonomy as far as how I perceive help people

Tayson: connect to the other doors, right, I can definitely relate to that. I kind of have that same feeling of like, I love the outdoor So much that I want to bring more people in the outdoors, have good experiences, growing up, didn't always have the best to experience is, you know, Frozen nights got soaking wet, you know, just different things. And yeah, if I was like a guy, Me help, you know, maybe 10 people at a time. Potentially have good experience Outdoors versus the tens of thousands of people that we've been able to help through the business side. So I can relate to that and like, maybe that's where they're disconnect is, is I get a lot of, you know, Joy from from helping people seeing people. I mean, every single day, someone's way like a loser, slack Channel, and our support team will drop things in, you know, reviews from customers feedback. And, you know, just seeing that pop in every day of just different things that people are saying it's super motivating even though like yeah I'm not Outdoors every day. I still have a lot of opportunity to go Outdoors. I'd say a lot more than most but It's there's stuff like some wording us.

Dave: I think I can relate to that too because I've had a career similar you know, working guiding outfitting things like that. And that Me and Nicole just talking about that, that gets old too, you know? Yeah. It sounds great to be outside all day every day, but it's nice to have some structure in your life. And, and So the position that we're in here and I'll drive, it's not nice because you do get the best of both worlds. You kind of have a structured schedule but that you still get to go all and enjoy, you know, they outdoors and you get to meet people that are in the industry and things like that. So I think that that for me that I was a big thing of transitioning and to you know, more career role but you still get to have the best. Of Both Worlds and I don't know, maybe that's a question for Nicole too. Like what what's your expectations of you know, still being in college and kind of trying to figure your self out and the direction you want to go in? Do you think that everyone that works in the outdoor industry is just Outdoors all day? Every day from, you know what, you know, all of it.

Nicole: Yeah. I mean, I think that's, like Jason said, that's what everyone wants. They want to be outside, but I think it takes a lot to understand that, you know, there's So much more behind that like the impact. Of being outside is great for yourself and it's self-enhancing and you know, like changing for you. But when you take a step back and you know, take yourself out of that picture for a second, you can instead bring other people into that world too. So I recently got a job with SEO Outdoors. And I'm training to be a trip leader. So you know, the main reason I'm doing this is So I can get other people outside its less about myself and more about, you know, expanding the experience of being outdoors for other people. Yeah.

Dave: I feel like that's what it comes down to for most people that are not doing it. Truly passionate of people aren't here to be outside all the time. They're here to get other people outside. I do,

Tayson: I think that's true. Well, this is this has been interesting. I definitely like there's some career paths here. Hopefully, if people are looking at career paths, we can provide some value there. But we also want to talk about some actual stories and experiences What drew me to you leave. I was definitely your experience is on Denali, So I want to bring that in. That's like in the back of my mind. I'm like, oh yeah, I'm gonna hike Denali day and after talking to him like holy am I anyways? But before maybe we dive into that story, you've been through a handful of seasonal jobs. Like you graduate. You start doing these seasonal jobs from the sounds of it. You know, what was your favorite seasonal job was? It Denali or was it a different one?

Levi: It's hard to say which one was my favorite? I think probably my favorite job was River. Guiding in Jacksonville Wyoming.

Tayson: That was probably my favorite seasonal job. Did you get that one summer more than that? I did it for the better part of

Levi: seven Summers. I worked for a few different companies up there and And a few of the Summers, I was only there for a shorter period. One of the Summers, I left early to ski patrol, New Zealand and then another summer, I left for a month to go up to Denali, and then other times, I would leave her a trip here or there. So but basically better part of seven Summers, I was up there So it was like your favorite part

Tayson: of that job. What? What made it the best? Yeah, it was a big combination of a lot of things.

Levi: The actual work itself was really enjoyable. It was really fun to be on the river. I'd say the people I worked with not only did we worked together, but we lived together and played together and had a really solid crew of people that was friends with that. We all had similar interests. We'd go kayaking after work, we'd go mountain biking out climb with people. That was awesome. And then I really liked The lifestyle that I had there in Jackson, I have guided on some other rivers where it's multi-day guiding Sierra involved anywhere from three to 1618 days for one trip and which is awesome. But it also has its Kind of downside to where it's kind of hard, entertain a personal life or pursue other, passions and hobbies. You don't have the social life be on hanging out with the guests, which is fun. But if you want to have, you know, other things going on, I feel like it was a good balance. I was like, I was overworked. There. I always add two days off. Most of the time for one of the companies I was working with. So I had yeah, good life balance. Really enjoyed my work didn't get too burnt out, I had really good opportunity and within the company I was with to do different things and moving to some different roles, even though the river and the runs never changed. I was able to kind of, you know, reinvent myself and do different things. So that's not one answer. It's many. But now that all those reasons why that was my

Nicole: favorite,

Tayson: for sure. I feel like the hardest part, for me would be kind of that social side. I think the like, there's a huge appeal, like man, I'm just rafting every day and then after work, I'm going and playing and different things, but I could see. It seems like there is kind of a cyclical thing where it takes a pretty special person to do that, their whole life, you know, seems like people going to do that for a time of their life and then they'll, they'll transfer on, which is kind of what happened to you, but I kind of want to dive into Denali here because it's it's just So it's So interesting to me, but So you were you were on Denali on a rescue team, which means basically you lived on the mountain throughout the summer and you would go and check on people and if you ever had rescues you would do that. Um, between all these different jobs that you've had, would you think this is like a funner one or like a not-So, fun one?

Levi: Yeah. So I guess for me, personally, I really enjoy that aspect of the jobs that I've had as far as like ski patrolling and being in a position to kind of help people in their worst moments. It's it might sound kind of weird as far as like you enjoy being there when people are having, you know, a hard time. But I enjoy being that person that Has intervened to have you know positive changing outcome for that person So

Tayson: she felt like like fulfilled in the job. Yeah.

Nicole: Was

Tayson: it like the funnest or just really good sense of fulfillment? I

Levi: think. It was some of both, you know, if we are making reference the type one, two, three,

Tayson: yeah. Yeah,

Levi: find the moment not as fun. The most fun to talk about later and it's not fun now and I don't want to talk about it later. Like it was mostly There was type one and type two, fun, and then occasionally type 3 phone. But you have this filter, you don't, you don't remember those kind of things as much, but it wasn't just all kind of funding games, it was, you know, some really hard grueling things, you know, some of the most Called more physically challenging days of my life happened on that trip.

Tayson: So So let's let's back up here for a minute and just talk about Denali in general. I bet I bet most of our listeners have no idea like what it really takes to hike. Denali So Denali for listeners. That's The biggest mountain in North America to my knowledge. It's up in Alaska. And So, what does it take to hike? Denali what kind of time frame? What kind of conditioning go through? Like, if you're someone that's just looking at, Denali to go hike, this. Tell them how intense it is because I thought it was like, oh yeah, I get in good shape and I'll just go do this. It'd be a thing. They just change the name of it too,

Dave: correct. Wasn't it something called something prior to that? I was on something.

Levi: Yeah, So the, the nameless necessary didn't change, but just So it's always been Denali, that's the native name for us, a mountain McKinley named after. One of the presidents as what it was kind of renamed. It was always still denied to the native people but I think they made a little bit more official that, you know, this is

Dave: okay, throwing someone off. So everybody's on the same page here.

Levi: So yeah, Mount McKinley. And Denali if you hear those two names, there's some autonomous essentially their referring to the same Mountain. So he had Denali like you had mentioned the highest peak in Northern North America, 20,000 3320 feet. It is special in the sense or particular that as far as the lat. Dude, you know it's pretty darn far north which makes it one of the coldest mountains in the world comparison to, you know, some of the other really large mountains out there. So The weather is. Barely. Yeah, the place that humans weren't meant to thrive. That's an easy way to put it just like any other high altitude mountaineering. I mean you're there in the summer all year, right? Yeah. So typically the climbing season, the majority of people are going to be attempting it from end of April until mid July is like the bulk of the climbing season So you like two months. That people are attempting it. Not to say that it hasn't climbed in Winter because it has, that's an interesting part of the history to look into. If you're starting to study up on it reading about some of those winter attempts. Yeah, when I say Burley more Burly, but yeah, the summer up there is unique in the sense that, you know, being that far north, you don't have, you know, the typical Darkness. So you know those wee hours of the night in the morning, it's more of kind of a Dusky look, you know. Somebody told me that you know you don't need to bring a headlamp, I don't believe him from a headlamp I'll be reading a book at 2 in the morning. You know I couldn't sleep. So as far as kind of what it entails, there's a handful of different routes on it, you know, as big as you want to go. But the most common route is on the west buttress. That's what most climbers are doing these days. And So what it looks like is Talkeetna is the kind of small little town, just that's closest to proximity the mountain. You get flown in push plane otter, Beaver, small aircraft fixed Wing. If you wanted to base Campground 6,000 feet, you got all your gear and typically people are either on skis or snowshoes especially for that lower part of the glacier that when you're navigating that potentially could have, you know, deeper snow And they're just traveling with, you know, really large pack and you're pulling a sled, that's typically, you know, the kind of gear that you have and So, you know, up to 100 pounds of gear that you're looking around. So that's that's a track. And your on the lower Glacier for quite a while. And So what that entails is being roped up to your team. And, you know, either two to four people, depending on the size of your team and your abilities and you're making your way up the mountain and there's not necessarily a trail per se, you know, and I if I ever mention to people, I'm I was on to know, they might think a mountain with the nice Trail and you followed up and You know there's there's no trees up there it's it's all all snow. All, all, Sarah, axle, ice, you know. Glacier. It's you're on snow. So not many Critters up there. Unless the classify the other climbers, this weird Critters and things. So

Tayson: the scariest of them all. Yeah. Yeah,

Levi: for being as remote and you know, big as it is, it is popular. I mean, I think the season I was up there, I think there were up to, I don't quote me on this. I'd have to double check this fact. But up to a 1000 climate, that attempted it, during that season. And So there's a few kind of established camps along the way that you're really gonna guarantee to see people kind of camping and the approach to kind of How High out to mountaineering is, you know, climb high sleep low. And So, in essence with that means is, you know, a climatize and you let your body adjust to this. This climate. There's not as much oxygen, obviously, You gain elevation and So your body needs time, your blood cells and all that, you need time to adjust. And if you're just to go from base to Summit and won't push, you're likely going to experience some altitude issues out to sickness, I'll do pulmonary demonstrate World demo things like that shortness of breath. So you essentially need the time more So to be held to adjust. And So it took us, I think we're about a week and a half before we made it to camp at 14,000, it's like 14,200 and that's really one of the main hubs on the upper mountain and with the park service, when I was there with them, they kind of have some some tents and infrastructure that they set up seasonally at Basecamp and a 14, and they have some gear caches a little bit higher up. So, We spent a lot of time at 14 camp and what that entailed was. You know, we were there as a resource with a climbers, whether we are checking permits, you know, educating people on, you know, proper disposal of human. Waste route conditions whether you know, talking to people educating, but essentially, the Park Service roll up, there is not a crutch for people, in the sense of like, hey, I'm cold. I know you guys got a sweet and you got a lot of food, can you help me out? It's like, you're up here on your responsible for yourself. Even the

Nicole: guy

Levi: to teams, you know, it's like, hey, you're responsible for your clients and we're here is kind of the last resource to step in and if we step in, you know, we're kind of taking over and generally, if it's for, you know, medical situation or a rescue like, Step in if we're going to intervene, you know, we're gonna, we're gonna make it happen and to be gone off the mountain, right? Like, if

Tayson: we intervene, you're done the mountain,

Levi: that's typically how it is. And I think that sets Sets up, people up for success, as far as making sure that people aren't relying on us as like a way the park service will be there. Now, I'm safe to, you know, take these risks. It's more. So like you're responsible for good decision making and for your group and as a last resort, we have the ability to potentially help you. It's an environment that unfortunately, sometimes it's just not, it doesn't make sense.

Tayson: Yeah. So you So you a week and a half to get to 14,000 feet

Nicole: but

Tayson: you're still a long ways from the Summits. So people looking at timelines here, you know, how much, how much longer is it going to take them to get to some because I, that actually really surprised me that it would take you that long to get to 14. So, I think

Dave: we even jump back a little bit further. What what's the permanent system? How many people are they letting up there? Is it a lot of Outfitters guys people doing it on their own? Like what's that look like

Nicole: preacher.

Levi: Yeah, yeah, good question. So yeah, I'll touch base on that and then kind of talk about time for him a little bit. So the permit system, you get to the National Park. The National Park Service, So they're in town. There's a ranger station and that's where you're doing your pre-trip briefings with the ranger and everything like that. They're making sure you got what you need. Outfitters. They have, you know, certain amount of qualified Outfitters that can

Dave: guide people on the mountain. So, how far in advance are people getting permits? Is it like, you know, like a zionic, three months that thing or like years ahead of time? Or is it like you get the permit first and then, you're grabbing an Outfitter or the Outfitter has the permits and they're looking for clients?

Levi: Yeah, So if you're going with an Outfitter, they have the permits. And So what that looks like for prep, depends on the company. Usually, you know, this is something you're planning out in advance. It's not like, hey, let's go climb to knowledge this weekend. It's like, I don't want to go climb to knowledge next year. Let's start touching base. What do I need to do to get prep? So, they're if it's now fit or they're going to be getting ready with gearless fitness programs, you know, essentially helping you along the process but you don't need to get your own permit for that if you're going. Up privately with your own trip. You feel self-sufficient and confident confidence to do this trip and you're getting that permit. I didn't have to get it since I was with the merch service So I can't remember exactly what the time frame. Is that

Tayson: Would be online on the Park service. But if you want to go, can you get a permit or is it one of those things that like you might not get to go? Yeah. You even if you want to

Dave: thank you. My question. I give it feasible to like to get up a rafting permit in the Grand. Canyon, you know, that's very hard to do. So is it like equivalent to that or?

Levi: Yeah, like a. Like I said, I can't remember all the intricacies of the details for the the permits, but from what I remember, just off kind of my memory of my field of what it was when I was there is that it's not gonna be as difficult to get a permit there as it would be to like a Grand Canyon rafting. I don't think it's quite the watery system like each other. They're not training as many people away, it's more. So there would be turning people way if they really feel like they were

Tayson: unprepared for the climb. All right, So you get your permit, whether that's through a guide or where the other system, you hike a week and a half to get to the 14 base camp. Now, what? Yeah.

Levi: And So even though we can a half just a quick note on that it might not take you that long. It takes us a little longer just because the idea of you know Park Service being there we have patrols that are staggered on the mountains So you have somebody to base camp now, somebody Weak later behind you and then you're moving up the mountain. So you basically have different patrols at different elevations, different parts of the mountain in with the ability to respond to things. And So we took a little bit more time than maybe he would need. But that also is dependent on weather. And So, the time frame that people are looking for to dedicate to climbing, Denali I would say, three weeks is a decent time to set aside three weeks to. I'm gonna be on the mountain for three weeks. You might be able to make it happen in 10 days. You might not even make happen in three weeks, you know, it all depends on a lot of factors. And I know the year, I was up there early season So like the month of May into June event. There was really low success rate of people summiting and those that did it was rolling the dice with your coming back with frostbite injuries hypothermia, you know.

Tayson: You're essentially what they're doing is they're getting almost to the peak, right? And then they're waiting for weather

Nicole: and

Tayson: So like, where they're sitting and waiting for the right weather, to actually get all the way up. What's that elevation at

Levi: ya? So between 14,000 feet and the summit, which is 20,000 300, 20 feet, So he got 6,000 feet of elevation gain. There's a high camp at 17,000 feet. The most people are making as an intermediate Camp. So What it's looking like. You spent some time out 14 week and a half, or whatever week it took you to get there and then you're making some missions. Of 17 gear drops up there, bringing some food up your climatized, keeping up on your Fitness, you know, climb high sleep low. And So your

Tayson: spend some time doing that, and then, if you're not just laying in Camp, like when I think of climatized, I'm thinking laying in my tent, reading a book, waiting days, and days. You know to climatize. Yeah,

Nicole: and

Levi: that might be the case if you have that, whether but if you have good weather, you are, you're wanting to be fairly active. You need to give your body appropriate, a rest, but also, You know climate, you essentially going to higher elevation spending time there and then retreating back to more oxygenated you know are and then as you kind of make that transition, your body is now a little more prep to make that move. Just So go once you've climate ties, maybe you've got some gear cashes up there along the way you're making it easier for yourself to now. All right, let's move to 17. We got a weather window, you spend the night there and then typically the summer, push happens in one day So you're going from 17 camp. The summit back to 17 in one day. It's typically on most people treat that

Tayson: you made. It sound like you're moving from 14 to 17 and like, Spike camping at 17 for not very long like like one night and then you're up and back down, is that right? Or you actually like setting up a potential long term

Levi: campus 17? Yeah, the idea is at 17, you just, you just don't function up there very well, regardless of how fit you are, it's just Yeah, both 17. And you just

Tayson: kind of like this ticking time bomb or like the longer you stay at that height or above like you're just progressively getting.

Levi: Yeah, it's really hard to you're not, you not performing to 100% up there and even if you have a climatized well it's just it can be really cool, you know, pretty brutal that way. And there's just not that much oxygen. A lot of people you know, Just sleep very well up there and it's really hard to put a blanket statement because everybody responds differently and it doesn't have as much to do with your Fitness. That does have a part of it, but more. So as far as your physiology your body and So like the lead Ranger that I was with, that was leading our team, you know, funny enough. He just didn't do as well at high altitude, whereas, you know, I may have done a little better than him and it wasn't necessary because I was more fit or more capable in that sense. So just my body responded a little better to it. So I'm just thinking in my head like all right I'm gonna go

Tayson: do Denali one day. Hypothetically, we look pretty close to about a 12,000 foot Peak. If I wanted to like start acclimating. Let's say like drug my trailer up there and I just left it there and I like drove up there every night slip in the trailer drove home with that significantly helped me. That's like the opposite of workload sleep high but yeah.

Levi: Um and some sense and So a climatize isn't necessarily something that sticks with you for a long period of time. So if you spent time at elevation took a couple weeks off and went back, it might not Direct. Translate as much, you know, it's not like sleep there right before you leave

Tayson: with that with that help. If you did it like right as

Levi: it would help some but you spend enough time up on the mountain where you're You take time to a climatize like there's some mileage to put in, and that's just kind of part of the process. And So I think it would help some. Yeah, it would help. So.

Nicole: Super.

Levi: I'm just trying to hack this

Dave: satellite, how your body handles it, and things like that he can like Summit Everest without Like Oxygen or something like that. They were saying like some people can just there's can do it like freaks.

Levi: Yeah. It's always a mountain that typically people are not using oxygen on Is in contrast to like the Himalayas or other mountains, where it is more commonplace. So Typically, people are taking supplemental oxygen up. Definitely,

Tayson: So. All right, So I think we've got a decent idea of what denali's like. Tell us that like a story about like a day. Let's say like one of the craziest days that you had on Denali and what what? That was like whether it's a rescue, I mean, you talk to me a little bit about the day you got to Summit which So being on the rescue team, he doesn't just get to you know recreational hike to the peak one day and come back down. It's it's can be rare for someone on the rescue team to get to Summit. You were able to Summit which, which was an awesome experience and

Nicole: and

Tayson: I'll ask you about that. But I guess. Let's first cover like, what was like the craziest day? Like on Denali what? I don't know what that, what did that look like?

Levi: Yeah. Thank. I remember just a quick little story. Of right after I landed on the mountain. So we just flown into base camp and base camp essentially the planes out, some skis on them, sort of able to land on the glacier and then take off. And So we just landed we are you know, unpacking all our gear, consolidating it? And then shortly after that another plane came in and was Landing in. This was just a Scenic flight. So sometimes the scenic flights will actually land and a lot of people to get out of the weather's nice and kind of cruise around and So it was a Scenic flight, it was landing and it was a particularly warm day. And you know what? The glacier there's snow bridges that are covering crevasses you know cracks in the in the glacier in. The snow. So as they landed one of the skis collapsed into the crevasse. And So now essentially you have this plane leaning and, you know, the wing tips, you know, dug down the snow. You know, one of the skis is now collapsed into a crevasse and we had just, you know, we're kind of settling getting our bearings and then this plane is stuck in a cross and So often you practice rescue, you know? So it's like, all right. We're the ones that do this like let's do this and So essentially what we did was we were able to you know get everybody out of the plane and it was funny the the family that was in the plane. I think we're from Florida, or somewhere here in the states and Didn't quite know that that's not typical

Dave: planes on generally collapse and courses like you know

Levi: it's a little exciting but we didn't really clue into like yeah that's all good. You know come on now we got saved spot a little bit and join the sunshine. Oh yeah, that's cool. So, how are we gonna deal with this? So I wasn't necessarily making all the calls. You know, this was kind of a new thing to me, but the with the other rangers there, we, you know, decided that we would get the this family out on another plane. This plane was a little bit damaged. And So we got him out on another flight and then we're able to deal with the crevasse. So we kind of proved it out deciding, you know, where the issues were and then essentially we got some And mechanics that were flown in. And with some of the other companies to help us out and with their help and, you know, a lot of, you know, a lot of Labor and work. We are able to take here, make this adjustment here. And essentially, what we're able to do was, you know, get some big boards and a hydraulic jack to be able to lift the plane up. Make some adjustments into the ski and kind of move things around. Eventually we're able to get a position where they're able to fire it up and get into a better spot. But I mean they had to make a few little repairs because you know, all that weight was on the wing now that you know, the ski in the ground is claps underneath it. So like the wing tip was damaged So with some

Dave: Guys. Yeah,

Levi: I mean those mechanics were rad like they're like, yeah, let's get it done. This is what we're gonna do and they were they were Super Rad and yeah, we made it happen and plain got,

Tayson: it sounds like the mechanics. I want to show up and I need help. Guys, this show with duct tape

Dave: hypnotized excited about stuff like

Tayson: that.

Levi: And it was my, it was sunny. It was, you know what we were? Freezing like wind ripping anything, So for the situation, like, things is the best outcome that came out of it. So, but that was like my introduction of Denali, it's like, okay, I guess this is what we do here.

Tayson: So, no, that's crazy. So once you're up on the mountain, did you ever have any fly offs? Like have to come in and fly people out of their, when you're up on the mountain? Yeah,

Levi: good question. So, typically on Denali every year rescue's happened typically every year, there's at least one fatality. Unfortunately, it's kind of the the inherent of the sport. It's like I said, it's not

Tayson: on my wife. Feel good about that. But I'm also like, I'm not like a big climber. So, he told me like you have to climb parts of Denali, right? Like you can't just hiked up a trail.

Levi: Yeah. So there's not necessarily a trail per se, the West buttress route is, is the least technical So I Saxon crampons or the minimum some rope skills. Glacier travel skills are necessary, but it's really most about the fitness and Until stamina and physical stamina in my opinion. You know, are you mentally strong enough to be able to be on a mountain in that kind of environment and kind of Endor? I think the endurance of both mind and body are probably two of the biggest challenges, the hard skills, people can learn those, you know, get a guide service, you know, take a class, you know start working on some of those things with a mentor. Those things people can learn that. Do you got The cool and the mind. So that's kind of the biggest thing. It's not incredibly technical the West buttress, but if you want something like the West Rib or the casino Ridge or something like that, like, it's Different story. You need some really technical skills. Now, it's good to know. I even we hiked

Tayson: King's Peak. We did it pretty early in June, there's still a lot of snow out there. And some of the guys on our team were like running up through the snow and like, like you could just like, for me, I'm like up there and I'm looking like, if I start sliding, I'm sliding.

Dave: Yeah,

Tayson: five, 600 yards down this hill, on the boulders, you know, something like guys are just like running up the snow and I'm just, like, I'm sitting there with my trekking poles digging him cleaning in every step. Like I'm like, this is sketchy for me, you know, So that's the question. I guess that I personally have, I just have more of those fears or whatnot but

Levi: I guess one Quick note on that as far as when I said, you know, this, you know, the physical and Minds stamina and the hard skills you can learn. I would say that's applicable. If you're going with the guide service, if you're going on your own, I think you're required. Additional skill sets as far as

Nicole: you know

Levi: understanding you know how to do when winter Mountain. You're making all your decisions up there if you're not guided, nobody's up there telling you what to do, you know, you're So You get pretty dialed. The reason why, you know, So many people have success in the sense of coming away unscathed or, you know, having some of it or whatever it might be, is because Majority of people that are up there, do have fairly good, mountain sense, not to say that people don't make bad decisions, we all do. So it's not hold everybody accountable for that, but So, if you're going on your own, I think it requires even more. But

Tayson: So like, what's a, what's a good bridge, the gap type Mountain, you know, to go and experience before you go all the way to something like Denali, yeah,

Levi: really the question, and a lot of the mountains in the Intermountain, West are just the United States in general. Don't always provide what you need because there's just not a lot of glaciers in the lower 48. There's a few places the Wind Rivers up and Wyoming. And then kind of the Cascades, you know, the Pacific Northwest. So a lot of times people are warming up On something like Rainier is a really good mountain kind of a training ground for people before Denali and then there's some other mountains, you know, in Canada things like that Alpine climbing. In general, whether you're climbing in the teton's, The Wind River range. The Songs like that. All kind of help those skills as far as moving efficiently through the mountains, having the fitness but the glacier travel is kind of a skill set all it's So you might not use another mountain in the Inner Mountain West. So those skills can be practiced and places

Dave: in Pacific Northwest usually do you have any idea of what an Outfitter costs for Molly? Like you someone wanted to grab an Outfitter. Park of what they'd be looking at.

Levi: That's a good question off the top my head Without Really, you know, looking at those things. it's in the thousands of dollars range, I would if I had to give a ballpark guesstimate out anywhere between like, Three to five thousand dollars, just a guess.

Tayson: I mean if you're that long on the mountain It's gotta start adding up for sure. Um So go back. Step back here to a rescue from 14,000 foot camp or whatnot. You did you actually fly anyone off? You said that it typically there's Fatality and there's fly offs. But did you experience that?

Levi: Yeah, So some of the more major rescues that happened that season I wasn't a part of all those. There was, you know, there was one fatality on the on the Summit Ridge, there was a really severe Cavazos fall axes and that happened early in the season that was kind of impressive as far as what they had to do and that's situation. I was involved in that So something that I was involved in it was you and the thing is minor things up there you know, twisted You know, this brand ankle, you know, this or that above arm, like all of the sudden and that sort of environment, something that, you know, even in, you know, the mountains by your house aren't, as big of a deal, you walk out up there, things get exacerbated, fairly quickly, they turn serious. And fairly fast. So, we had just made the move from 11,000 to 14,000 feet. And at that point, there were two other patrols there. And one Patrol was getting ready. Now, we're bumping them out of their duties there, 14, they're going up to high camp, the other team that was there at, just come down from high camp. They had summited and come down and they're getting ready to ski out and make it down to base camp, late at night and get flown out the next morning. So what happened was we were doing that transition of teams and we all hang out, you know, had some food. I'm enjoyed each other's company and caught up with people and then Late in the evening, you know, that team was getting ready to ski down you know, hoping to ski down in the most firm snow stable conditions especially on the lower Glacier you want to be traveling when things have kind of set up and are you know, Frozen So they left late and we ended up getting a call on the radio. Not soon after we say goodbye and you know, they were skiing away and one of the members of the team had essentially entered his knee really bad because what happens is as you're descending there on skis and you want to stay roped up because you're in glaciated terrain, you know, for the potential for gross fall. And So what had happened was the snow at a lot of sun on it at that day, it cooled off and you have a nice little Frozen crust of cap on top, makes it really challenging to ski. And something that happened, where, you know, we got caught up in the crust and took The fall and really, you know, hurt his knee down. I just need to the point where he wasn't able to, you know, continue and So they're in between 11 and 14 camp, and we had the decision, you know, what are we going to do to help help the situation. We have this team that's getting ready to go. High, you know, we had just come up from 11. We were really tired, our team was, you know, pretty tired from having a really big day and Were trying to, you know, get it flowing out in the morning and So we essentially made a plan that the other lead Ranger on my team myself, essentially volunteered that we'll go help the situation. And So we ended up skiing down back, down to them, met up with the team, kind of analyze, the situation that took a look at his knee, and decided that it would be best mitigated by helping him back up to 14 and the rest of the team could continue down to get flown off the next day. So, we Essentially kind of divided up his gear and we're able to assist him back up to 14 Camp, weather set in assistant, like are you dragging

Nicole: him

Tayson: know? I mean, for those of you and you can't see this but leave us kind of a big guy. I mean you're what six Six, six, six, six and to fit. So I can see, leave. I just like, I just hop on my back. I'll just walk you

Levi: in my idealistic heroic mind. Yeah, that's the story know. I was, I was spent at that time and So the best course of action. Fortunately, he was mobile enough to wear with his ski poles. He was kind of able to limp back divided up the gear, you know, gotten a rope team and It was mostly able to kind of Lent himself along with, and So that was good. If it wasn't, if he wasn't mobile at all, that would have changed your approach to things of how we dealt with the situation and So we got him back to 14, weather said in. So we just kind of hung out there with us. We have a med tent there and everybody on the team was medically trained. We all had a med lead. So anywhere from like a paramedic to a doctor that was on every team So we're able to do as much as we could. But you know an injured knee while I really need an MRI and surgery, potentially depending on what it is. So, he eventually got flown out by helicopter from 14 Camp, So, Now was an incredibly Serious injury but like I said, you know, minor things up there can turn serious fairly quickly. Alright alright Now it's definitely interesting.

Tayson: I mean like you say it's hard I think it's hard for people totally understand like what Alaska is like to and being that remote and how scary Distant. You are I mean you go hike a mountain and Colorado or something like half the time you get to the peak and you can look off the peak and maybe see buildings or something somewhere. But Alaska, I mean, it's just a totally, totally different ballgame. So, super interesting. Well, maybe I don't know if I have any more questions about Denali per se, you did actually I did say that we would talk a little bit about the day you got to

Nicole: Summit.

Levi: Yeah.

Tayson: So tell us what it was like. I mean, you've been up there. How long at this point? Probably two and a half weeks or So. Also, it was early for you when you got to Summit

Levi: things lined up the Stars, aligned we are, I think we're up on the mount for about three weeks total because some of the time that I spent there was in preparation tell Kina. Some of it was kind of debrief clean up after the facts. I think we're on the mountain itself for

Tayson: about three weeks. Okay? I'm out three weeks and you get a weather window. Correct where you up at the

Levi: high camp at this point? Yes. So the way it worked out we had we were the last full Patrol on the mountain and then the last team that came up was essentially taking things down and making lots for the helicopter to fly out and he stuff that the Park Service had brought on and they aren't going to go to high camp. 14, was kind of their destination to be able to clean up everything that we had on the mountain. And So they were originally scheduled to fly on and be able to bump us out to give us, you know, a little bit of a window to be up there, a hike Camp, if things worked out, they got delayed because of weather. So, when they showed up, we really had a short window of time. I think when they finally showed up, it was like, July 3rd and we were flying out like July 5th.

Tayson: So you've been on the mountain for months though, right? You didn't didn't you come in April or? No, I didn't come at the first the climbing

Levi: season. So no, I was there. Reform. Yeah, I was, yeah, I was at the very tail end of the season So they have patrols, usually they're set up Patrol starts, like first part of may end of April and then I have, you know, five or six patrols that are staggered out throughout That season through those two months. Okay, got it. Got it. And So yeah, we really only had that short window of like, you know, are we gonna be able to go up there doesn't make sense because Also a part of your responsibility on this team is to be in a position to help and if it's not necessarily just a self-interest of mentality of like we want to Summit, that's where we're here. Like no, or purpose is something different? And if we have the Opportunity. That's kind of the cherry on top of it. It's not necessarily the reason that I was there. So but yeah, we had a good weather window things. We're looking good. So we said hey, let's go to high camp. We had already been up there a few times to climate ties. And yeah, we got up there, July 3rd evening, July 3rd, we made up to high camp. And there are a few other teams that were kind of making the push at that time as well. And So, The park service, we don't. Know. That's like to make the Precedence of Being the first to do something to kind of set the set. The bar of like, okay, the park service is going, it's safe to go. We typically like to encourage people to make their own decisions. May or may not choose to counsel or react in a certain way. So we essentially allowed the teams they decide to get out to try and Summit. We kind of hung out and saw how they're doing. And then decided to yeah, that we were gonna give it a shot that day. So it was July 4th and So we have four on our team, one of them stay behind, because it just weren't feeling it. This weren't doing too well at altitude, So they decided to hang out there at camp. And she had the other three of us. Yeah, we went for it and Yeah, it was one of the coolest days of my life, for sure. It was one of the hardest days in my life as well. Probably it was the coldest day that I ever got on the mountain. You know there was a time it was section called the Autobahn and its most of its in the shade fair amount of Windsor. If you know snow blowing around But time, we got to the South where we finally got to some sun. I mean, my feet were really cool and I might have to turn back because, you know, they're getting to that point. And So I was able to fortunately at some toe warmers with me and So

Nicole: I was

Levi: Joke about getting off my boots really quick, and, you know, kind of massaging my feet, trying to get some blood flow back to them. Got some toe warmers on her and put my boots back on, because the wind was blowing on the on the, on the ridge there and then we kept moving eventually, they started kind of come back So that was kind of

Tayson: exciting. What kind of temperature ranges are you looking at? In on this day, what kind of temperatures?

Levi: Yeah, it's hard to say for sure what? Exactly it was. And one of the big things up there is wind and So even if you have ambient temperatures of 10 degrees or something like that, which if you have the right gear, you know, isn't a huge deal. But if you're looking at the winds on the Summit Ridge and you get Winds of 20 miles an hour, you know, the wind, chill factor changes things very quickly. And So the wind is really, what will be up up there Beyond just the Ambient Air Temperature. So I mean, wet gear to yeah, that's a challenge as well. I'll just keeping your gear dry. I mean, the temperatures. Yes. See a big swing, you know, on the middle of the day, you know, there was times like a t-shirt, wouldn't, you know, be cool enough. Like, you were just cooking up there at the sun's blazing, you're in this big of it and So like Sunburn and, you know, staying dry and, you know, staying out of the Sun, not getting Zapped as I was like, you know, every single layer you have on and you're cold. Yeah. Like the idea is keep moving.

Tayson: Yeah, So it's made for humans.

Levi: So yeah, we are. The other we caught up to the other teams. They're moving a little bit slower pace and eventually we got in front of them. And yeah, we're able to yeah we made the sum of push and we kind of took turns a couple of us breaking Trail and leading. And then yeah it there was a point where some kind of clouds and it looked like some weather was maybe in a closing. So I was kind of like okay we might need to turn around. This might be up. Somehow the clouds, kind of kept at Bay. The never really socked in the weather held. And when we summited it, it was Beautiful. It was Blue Sky, sun was out. Its super, as long as you'd see in any direction, you know, you're the highest point in North America on the fourth of July, like it was incredible. I had a some ski socks on the American flag. Don't stop, just So happened to half of the Fourth of July, you know, just actually kind of my pants pulled up my support. Trees.

Tayson: You said one of your team members brought a guitar, right?

Levi: Yeah, one of the guys, he was a pair of Jumper with the Air Force, out of Anchorage. He was on our team and he had this carbon fiber body like kind of smaller guitar that he had brought along loved all the way up to the summit, and it was pretty special moment because it was just our team up there. The other guy, the teams were a bit behind and So we had to sum it all to ourselves as he was just us, not hardly any wins Sunny calm and he ended up pulling it out and played Stairway to Heaven.

Nicole: He was

Tayson: really cool. So yeah, I think it's So hard to like, just try to totally put yourself in that situation and just grasping it at the memory is her experiences. I've had in my life but for something to listeners that maybe have not had that type of experience, you know, start Look at some Peaks and things that are near you. Look at some things that are practical and definitely get out there and try it. You know, when you do get to the top of that Peak, it's, it's, it's crazy rewarding. I mean, it's seems silly, or like, I'm just at the top of this peak, there's no use in this, but there's a huge use mentally physically mental toughness, it's super rewarding. And I mean I'm sure that forever. You're going to have just that that type of a panoramic snapshot in your mind. And when you think of that you're going to think of all that you know, type two fun. You had Ormond, your feet up and different things but it's never, it's a memory you'll never forget for sure. So Encourage our listeners to get out there and try to have some of their own Adventures, whether you or is tough as Levi, and try to not only or you do something more, local, or practical. It's, it's great

Dave: fun. Thanks peek in your state. If you can, you know, depending on where it is not Washington. Yeah.

Tayson: Yeah. For sure. So, before I move on, from Denali real quick, How cold were you getting at nights? Typically like, what type of sleeping systems were using.

Levi: So, yeah, that's another thing that is vary from person to person, as far as you know, do you sleep warm sleep cold? So we were up a little bit later in the season and So, In contrast like being up there in may he typically prepare a little bit differently. So people will have, you know, either anywhere from like a native, 20 to a negative 40, rated sleeping bag is pretty common. Typically, you're going with two sleeping pads. To give you some more insulation having an rally, you close So small and air mattress. That's what I had. So I'd like a therm arrest foam and then a wrestling air mattresses So I had a zero degree back from most of it and then I did use a -20 for part of it. I probably could have got away with the zero degree that time of year, but we had pretty good. Weather comparatively to the season.

Tayson: How did you keep your gear? Like like there's no way to keep your gear dry all the time. Like, what's your biggest tips or tricks? To keeping your gear dryer? You're getting in your sleeping bag with wet clothes, sometimes trying to dry them out? Or is there something that might be able to look by people that haven't been in a scenario to try out their their gear and don't snow in winter conditions. Yeah, and So

Levi: kind of the back end of of things as really Being. You know, strategic on how what gear you use first of using the best gear that you can get for those type environments because your gears you're safe to your life. It's not just Comfort but it's like safety and it's safe to you and it's a team. And So that's something to think about of having a nice nicest gear because it'll make it a lot easier and then being intentional about how you use it in a trying to avoid getting it super wet if possible but inevitably things get wet your feet sweat. I sweat out on a big dude and I sweat a lot and So things get wet. And So typically the way I would deal with it is feet Foot Care is like number one like drying out your feet. You know keeping your feet happy. I always say. Happy Feet is. Happy me. Happy me. You know it performs a lot better. Whether that's rock climbing, mountaineering skiing if you've got Happy Feet translates to mental health and like performance. So keep your feet dry. And So I had a couple pairs of socks and typically in the, we had tents and every night, you know, you peel off the stinky wet stuff, and we'd hang it up just with some paracord inside our tent and then allow it to dry and then put on a fresh pair that had already dried from the day before or whatever. And

Tayson: like it would dry during the day, then it would get warm enough for enough Sun contact to dry him.

Tayson: frozen in the morning.

Nicole: out

Nicole: So

Tayson: I'd say.

Levi: Yeah. Or just, it's not as humid up there and So, typically just just with kind of the body heat in the tent and just being are dried like things would eventually dry out or if it was sunny get stuff out in the sun, The stuff that I was going to be using the next day, like absolutely like boot liners, whether it's for a mountaineering or ski boot, I would typically sleep with those. So I would sleep at the handful of items like I'd sleep with gloves, maybe things that I needed warm immediately as I got out of bed. So, my ski boot liners and stuff, were all in my sleeping bag and your body heat kind of helps dry things out. And if nothing else at least keeps it kind of warm. Whereas otherwise, any moisture that is on an article clothing is going to be

Levi: So, if you don't put your boot liners in your sleeping bag, they're gonna be Frozen and you're putting your foot into a frozen boot in your foot's, going to get cold and I might not go in that food, So

Tayson: get wet. fast soon, as it's heated up, it's wet. And yeah, your body heat can help kind of dry things

Tayson: within your. Are you still using a down? Sleeping bag on this trip? I yeah, I use down sleeping bag and we just went on a trip where we were doing winter stuff and I had a lot of condensation, a few things. And I was using this Loft Tech hybrid bag and I kind of concealed like like where you're setting up camp and you're leaving it throughout the day. There's stuff like that opportunity to dry stuff out, but if you were Amp every day. Not getting some contact throughout the day, different things like that. I would, I'd wonder if, you know down bag or if you're getting in with any kind of wet things, if that might start to lose integrity. So, I don't know that. I'm excited for this installation. I think there might be some applications and for me personally, if I'm looking at what bag I would take, I might hedge towards like a like The Loft Tech hybrid. Just So that I could get in my bag with wet gear and not fear that, that's You know, weighing pros and cons, like I wouldn't have to have that battle in my mind I guess. But

Tayson: favorite piece of gear that you had on this. I mean, Obviously your buddies was carbon fiber guitar. What was

Levi: yours? Those very essential to making it actually. I mean I had the guitar. I probably

Levi: A dinero down to one piece. I think it was a son hoodie like that thing saved me. So I'll just, you know, there's a few different companies that make him. It's essentially a white kind of silkweight. Hoodie made out of

Tayson: you know lightweight I don't like

Levi: a sun shirt

Tayson: just like a Columbia Sunshine. Okay. That I had a hood. It was white

Nicole: and

Levi: Skits blazing up there like you get crushed by, you know, the microphone we're using is like straight up red. Yeah, you look like that in like, 10 minutes. So I have like, SPF 100 sunscreen that I was put on this in my ears and like, Glacier glasses. You know that have, you know, they're a lot darker lens and they have the protection on the side. People will sun burn the inside of their mouths, the inside of their nose, like the Sun up there is you're in an oven like it's In So those days when the sun's Blaze them like that, white sun, hoody, putting the hood on, you know, covering up having stuff on my hands. Like I don't want to see the Sun up there So that was Once was to not get frostbite and to not get lit up by the suck because there was, I saw a guy one day that he had a shirt off at Camp just for a little bit, kind of, you know, doing a few things drying out, didn't have it off for very long, and then later that night, he was hanging out at our camp and he was a tomato and was and then all the sudden. Yeah. Like that's an issue challenge because like your body can't regulate its temperature, your cold, your hot. Yeah,

Tayson: That's totally. That's So that's just crazy. I mean, there's So many things to think about in a scenario like this with Denali I'm fascinated by it. I, I don't know. Like it's it's extreme thing but it's also just just There's not that many people that have Down Under accomplished it or been in those scenarios and just hearing about it is definitely, definitely interesting. But So I want to move on just a little bit and talk a little bit more about As you in and of itself, as you use, is the college that I attended. I was not an outdoor rec major and I did not probably fully understand all of the opportunities that were just available to all issue. Students, if you're a student, you know, college age or looking at college, we encourage you to look at suu if you have a lot of interesting Outdoors it's definitely just a fantastic Hub of opportunity there but We talked a little bit with Nicole about why she chose to go to sheu, but but let's talk a little bit more practical, you guys actually put together trips consistent trips where you're taking students out to do things. And my understanding is that recently just had one of these correcting

Levi: around, Moab, is that correct? The rafting trip. We did in the Grand, Canyon Grand Canyon. And that was

Tayson: just recently, right? Like

Levi: last month and March.

Tayson: So, caucus about that, like, let's say your student, your dash. You're at suu, you know, how do you, how do you get on this trip? And what do you guys do to help them get on these trips?

Levi: Yeah, yeah. Really good question. Nicole to speak to the summit. Yeah, let's hear from your perspective.

Nicole: Yeah, So um luckily because I'm employed with SEO outdoors, I got to be an apprentice guide, So my role was helping out Levi, Jake Kelly, the other guides with a bit of the planning packing and along the trip. Cooking, cleaning stuff like that. So I think I had a pretty unique role but as a student It's an opportunity that is just So incredibly special. You can just this trip, specifically had a cost, but most of the trips offered by SEO doors are free to all students.

Tayson: What would be like a free trip?

Nicole: We had some any hiking hiking trips even several. Day. Backpacking trips can be free. That's country skiing. I have a question like the mountain biking trips. Do you guys? Apply the bikes or how does that work with those temperature? So that's actually something that I have been interested in. Yeah. We

Levi: You different mountain biking trips that we offer in the year and right now we don't have a bike rental Fleet and So we're renting them from somewhere in town and So our ratio from staff to participant is a little bit lower on those on those trips just with the sport of mountain biking as well. You can't take as many people. As you might take hiking, we're looking to have some mountain bikes here in the near future as part of our rental Fleet and for our programming. So right now it's a bike. So we written in town.

Dave: So does the student run that or do you guys run that?

Levi: Yeah for the mountain biking trip, we provide the mountain bikes So for pretty much all the trips. If there's any gear that's kind of a technical piece of gear, whether it's a climbing harness, Mountain bike. Rafting gear, all that kind of stuff. The technical gear is provided, and oftentimes even other gear can be supplemented through our rental program. So, if you need a sleeping bag, we can provide that if you need a tip, we can provide that. So typically, we're providing food Transportation, the know-how, and the student leaders and Nicole. I guess if you can kind of explain that

Dave: trip that you guys went on to, it was a multi-sport trip. Is that what you guys did?

Nicole: Yeah.

Tayson: Yeah. Maybe

Dave: you can talk a little bit about that. Like, go back a little bit and talk what you guys actually did or what? What that was?

Nicole: Yeah. Yeah. So then the web multi-trip was three nights, right?

Levi: Yeah.

Nicole: Okay. Yeah. So we just took a van full, um, Levi and another guide Keith and Four or five students. We went out to Moab for spring break and we experienced all four seasons in that time period. So that kind of switched up our plans a little bit. We got a full day of hiking in all around arches and we went climbing the last day. We got some sun with some, we did some Canyon earring through arches as well. It was kind of a trip where we could get a little bit of everything. So each night we're out there camping and cooking and just an opportunity for everyone to just get outside, get to know each other and learn.

Tayson: yeah, I think I think it's just a really phenomenal opportunity because You know, a lot of people, a lot of people who are listening to us, they might not have that skill set to know how to do stuff themselves. Just kind of like, you guys are like, taking him by the hand, you're saying, look, we're gonna apply on the trip. We're gonna plan on the transport, we're going to have someone who can answer questions on site and then if you need gear, you know, we rent gear. Ridiculous rates, you know So we can we can help you out with gear and then if you want to buy gear we you guys retail a little bit of gear, it really good discounts for students. So sue, definitely has some really cool stuff going on there. Where, I mean, if if you if you're already experienced you can hop on these trips and you know, maybe be more like you are where you get to be a lead on these trips. If you don't have experience, they're gonna be able to take you by the hand and get you in the outdoors. And, and So, who was, who was able to go on these trips? Is it strictly students? Is it strictly students that are in this program? The Outdoor Rec program or is it? General public. Yes. So as as the way

Levi: our structures now for our programming specific to trips, it is for current and role as you students. And So it you don't have to be a part of the academic program or be taking out direct related classes. It's for anybody, the way our sign ups work is two Mondays, prior to the trip going out. So, most were trips to have them weekend. So if it's a Saturday trip, not the money that precedes it but the one following that the proceeds it, you would sign up at noon. It's first. Come first serve. So there's It there's equal opportunity for everybody to be able to come in, sign up and we're not holding spots for people or, you know, doing this or that. So it's just first come first serve, we stagger the openings like that versus if we just did them all at the first the semester and everybody signed up. Somebody comes in mid semester and says, hey, I want to sign up for true. They all filled up two months ago, So it kind of the, that's the way we do it. It also kind of helps, you know, if somebody sign up for a trip in January and we leave in April and they're like, oh yeah, I forgot like okay I can't go I think it kind of shows a little effort on the students part to come and actually be present to sign up and show that. Hey, I do want to go on this trip and with a few of them, you know, there might be a small fee Associated just to help kind of supplement some of the costs. As some of the trips that go further have additional costs associated with them. So

Tayson: yeah. I see you. They've also won some awards in the past. Correct. I can't think of the name

Dave: is that they have like the trademark University of the parks. I know that that is one of them, but outdoor Nation, I think it was two years ago, they did. A contestant. I know, actually you won the most Outdoors eats considered the most outdoorsy University in the country. And the alternation is the same people that put on Outdoor Retailer, they're associated with that. So, you're not familiar with SG. Definitely take a look. If you're interested in like me, personally, I'm a little bit older and decided to go back to school and take outdoor recreation classes because that's what I'm interested in now and I love it. It's great. It's, it's Super fantastic to know. I wish a lot of these things that I knew, you know, when I was guiding and things like that, even just people skills and Leadership and stuff like that.

Tayson: Yeah, well, you know, I appreciate you coming on. You know, telling us some stories again, super fascinating just to hear about Denali and I'm just kind of here, some of your seasonality work. I wanted to give you definitely a chance to talk about, you know what you're doing at SUU. And hopefully we've covered that if people have some interest or want to, you know, gain contact with Sue. And I mean, you guys have an Instagram page, that's specifically shoe Outdoors, correct. We just So look that up. You can start to see some of the things that they're posting their Any other ways that you would advise them to reach out or get involved if they have interest? Yes. So if you're

Levi: a student, if you're a local, or if you're even just passing through the area, we are not exclusive to our offerings. As far as just students, we will be expanding, I think our trips program down the line to public and Community, but the public can get involved in other ways right now, we have a climbing wall on our PE building. That's open to the public and for reservation as well. We have our rental program, So the public can come in and rent gear. There's some retail there as well. We have a challenge course, that's all So, really popular among special, like youth groups or, you know, companies and things coming in, want to do some some teamwork, related, physical activities. And So we have a lot of things like that going on. That's their Facebook and Instagram are really good way to kind of have a you know an idea of

Nicole: what we

Levi: have going on as far as events, whether it's our, you know, bouldering competition that we have over at the wall this weekend or we are involved in playing and putting on the southern Utah climbing Festival which We've made a couple of attempts at but weather wasn't cooperating, So we'll probably be doing that this fall. So we're involved with a lot of things that get the community together and if you're listening to this and you're like, I live in California, right? You know, I'm not gonna go to suu or, you know, I'm 40 years old and I'm not going back to school. If you like, I want to get involved in, you know, something different, something new I want to go river, rafting or I want to do some mountaineering. The cool thing is in most communities, especially I think where a lot of the listeners are listening from, there's opportunity for it and it might not exist in the form that you think it is, you don't necessarily have to take a College University level class. Do you learn how to backpack? You know, there might be a local Outfitter. Gear shop that has some sort of program or Meetup program. There could be, you know, an REI, maybe that's nearby, an REI has all sorts of programs whether it's from bike maintenance to, you know, groups to meet up to do different trips. So, if there's Anything outdoors related in your community, there's probably an opportunity for you to get involved. That's one of the big challenges. Is a lot of outdoor sports. You need other people. Not all of them. Can you do Solo or even if you can, maybe you don't feel comfortable initially getting into it, in that sense. And So there's definitely good ways to go about it. You know, by getting qualified instruction or, you know, going out with people that can help Mentor you through that process. And if you don't know those opportunities start looking, you'll start reaching out in a few of those different places. Whether it's a school, you know, a business, some Facebook groups, things like that. There's lots of opportunity out there,

Tayson: I think that's good advice. I mean, we encourage our listeners, you know, to listen to us, but also to watch our YouTube channels and we try to provide some of that education, but there's lots to be said about doing it local and finding, you know, connections and friends. And As you said that I was thinking about a conversation. We had this morning Dave's wife is gone and not gone gone but not this time but he's like yeah I love, I love watching, scary movies and she's gone. She doesn't like them. I love them. And I'm like, yeah, you know, I don't watch a ton of scary movies because when I'm, you know, five or 10 miles back into the back country, I don't want those thoughts coming up and I'm solo clear back in here and then this tree creeks and I'm freaking out, you know? But yeah, you know if you have fears like that, if you watch scary movies and still want to go back So you know, local meetups things like that can definitely help you get the team or the assistance that you might be looking for. So before we close this down, I do like to ask a specific question, but generally find, there's a few things that keep people from getting. More often those three would be time money or experience. I'll have both of

Levi: you answer this but in your experience or knowledge, you know of those three you can time money

Tayson: or experience. What do you think keeps people from getting outdoors? And, you know, and going and living out these

Levi: Adventures the most Yeah, good question. I think. For the most part, A lot of those. Answers. a workaround as far as like, All the time. Well, we all have the same amount of time in our days. It's just how we prioritize it. So if you feel like you don't have the time, it might just be, you know, switching some priorities around, you know, changing things up, money, I could understand. So, you know, everybody's situations different, there are certain things that, you know, do require money, you know, buying the gear, you know traveling, you know what do you need a car to get there if you don't have those things. The awesome thing is, there's plenty of stuff that doesn't require any money. If, if you have some physical ability to get outside, you know, even just going for a walk like start small know, and makes some connections with people. You know, there might be people that already have the gear that maybe have a car that have the time, you know, things like that. So, and I think there's also, yeah, I don't have anybody to go with them and just kind of the fear of the perception of maybe

Tayson: technology. Like, I haven't done this on the confidence, like So do you think that's the big one then or if you had to pick one?

Nicole: Yeah.

Levi: You said, if I had to pick from your experience

Tayson: sounds like you you feel like there's some workarounds for time and money.

Levi: Yeah. And then I definitely understand the kind of Fear Part of I don't feel prepared and if that's your your take, I'd say that's almost kind of good. Do you have kind of a conservative approach, you know, on the on the reciprocal end of like I'm just getting after I'm doing anything and you know,

Tayson: caution to the wind, people are

Dave: either side. I have no idea what I'm doing. I'm gonna go do this,

Levi: eventually that's gonna catch up to you not the stuff doesn't happen to everybody but that that Outlook is going to catch up to you eventually. So if you have kind of that cautious, like I'm a little scared or fearful of this, It's good. Keep out the skepticism, you know, have that conservative approach and in doing So, there's opportunity out there, So seek it out. If that's your, if that's your hanging up. Well, then, you know, look a little harder. There's going to be some opportunity out there, whether it's finding a mentor finding another program, finding a Meetup Group having somebody else to kind of help you along the way. So, So

Tayson: Levi, no excuses,

Dave: and things like that. You know, a lot of these things are free and good possibility of meeting, someone that has the same interests as you that they could do that on their own. You know, you meet somebody at a Meetup or a shoe event or just an event in your area. Okay, this guy a girl has the same, you know? Skill set or whatever. And there you go, you gotta Adventure buddy. So I think taking advantage of local things and if you want to do it, I feel like you're gonna do it. Some somehow you'll look it up, find a group online or something like that.

Levi: Yeah.

Tayson: So for you,

Nicole: cool. Yeah, I I really agree with Levi. I think there's workarounds with pretty much anything being a college student. The money is probably my biggest challenge, but there's a, there's a workaround SEO doors finding friends with more knowledge. I used to be the kid. That was just, let's send it, you know, climbing mountains in that myself, no experience. And I was like, kind of like, hold on a second. Like let's let's find a group and it's, it wasn't hard. It was just that prioritizing, you know, something I want to get into finding mentors with those hard skills. And, and really just just setting that up for Success,

Tayson: right now, I think, I think that's great, one of our other employees or team members here. He's also a student of the shoe. He's a business student, but he also just has a group of super outdoor focused friends and they're always doing things every weekend. It sounds like that's kind of something that you found at us, you use. So definitely a lot of people. To you that have that same kind of mindset. So, well, let's go ahead and close this up. I really appreciate both of you being here. Again, I found a lot of this. Just really interesting to really dive into some of those details. I hope our listeners did as well, but appreciate you coming on for sure. And for our viewers, you have any questions? And as always, reach out to us, Supported out our vitals.com, you can get a hold of us or come on and to our website and we can chat with you again. Dave, as well as one of our new team members Jordan is running that chat full-time. So we can we can answer questions on gear. We can answer questions on all sorts of.

Dave: Yes. Even if, like, we talked about, if someone's coming around this way, they're coming to Southern Utah. They have any questions about anything, you know, they can message us. That's even something that you can go in and yeah, stop in there, right? We're right between Bryce and Zion stop in and see them. See us ask questions, you just the resources around you.

Tayson: So thank you, thanks for tuning in. We'll catch on the next podcast and keep living ultra light.

Dave: To help us spread the word about the Live Ultralight lifestyle. Please give us a five-star review and tell your friends to subscribe, where are available on Apple podcast, Spotify, Stitcher, and have you made you listening app as well as little Ultra light.com. So, thanks for listening.